Should I run a dummy or a second powered loco

[N-Railer]

this is a total newbie question so please be patient. I am just getting back into the hobby after a 20 year Hiatus...boy things have changed.

I have purchased a new Spectrum series D8-40C CSX Loco, I want to add 1 or perhaps 2 more locos to this run...not the line, I am trying to find a Bachmann dummy to add to my powered loco and I can't...where should I be looking...local hobby shops are no help? OR should I just buy a second powered spectrum and run them attached? also I have a cool set of Bachmann plus Pennsylvania passenger cars (they light up) and combine...what Loco would best represent these cars being pulled, I am aiming towards reality rather than "just what I like"

thanks for helping an "old" newbie!

[fieromike]

this is a total newbie question so please be patient. I am just getting back into the hobby after a 20 year Hiatus...boy things have changed.

I have purchased a new Spectrum series D8-40C CSX Loco, I want to add 1 or perhaps 2 more locos to this run...not the line, I am trying to find a Bachmann dummy to add to my powered loco and I can't...where should I be looking...local hobby shops are no help? OR should I just buy a second powered spectrum and run them attached? also I have a cool set of Bachmann plus Pennsylvania passenger cars (they light up) and combine...what Loco would best represent these cars being pulled, I am aiming towards reality rather than "just what I like"

thanks for helping an "old" newbie!

Welcome back!
Bachmann doesn't (intentionally) sell dummies of these engines.  You can either buy additional powered locos, or strip the guts out of one.  Most locos made into dummies like that have rolling qualities just slightly better than a brick.
Most likely power for your Pennsy passenger cars would be a K4 steamer, GG1 electric, or possibly an E or F set of locos.  Remember that the Pennsy went belly up quite a while ago.

Mike

[N-Railer]

hmmmm, so buying one to "gut" doesn't seem practical for my budget, I will keep my eyes out for something to fit the bill...


what do you mean "remember the pennsy went belly up?"





for my layout I am not concerned about trains fitting the surroundings (I actually have 2 tomix tomas trains (thomas and james...n scale really cool) for my son to drive, I have 2 line layout, BUT I do like to keep engines realistic with thier loads...which brings up another question, I am working on a military (army) train, I have gathered a couple of pullman sleepers, a kitchen and a flat bed with tank load...what kind of engine and what would it look like...is used by the army to pull a load?

[Inder]

The army had a bunch of 2-8-0's.

I like 2-8-0's and Bachmann makes the best (in my opinion) 2-8-0 currently on the market.

If you get the undecorated version or whichever version and just change the loco number to whatever Army picture 2-8-0 you find you will be set.

It is an extremely good engine.  I find them on ebay for around $60 all the time.  Thefavoritespot is an online retailer who I buy from all the time.  If there is ever a problem he will exchange for you.

[Train Nutz]

Hi N-railer,

    The term used by fieromike  "remember the pennsy went belly up?" is akin to the disastrous merger of the Pennsylvainia & New York Central railroads forming the new road Penn Central. Techincally, the Pennsy itself didn't go belly up but a couple of years after mergering with NYC it did big time. The merger took place in 1967 and by 1971 the company went bankrupt. When 1976 rolled around the U.S. government decided it would take a group of failing east coast roads and group them together under one name: Conrail. Penn Central got assorbed into this. Supossably ever letter in the name Conrail is suppose to represent the name of each road that was bought together to make this railroad. Maybe one Conrail fan will
post here to debunk this theory whether this is true or not?
                                          trainnutz


   
   

[fieromike]

Thank you, N-railer.
You saved my bacon!  I almost had to admit that I didn't know all the details about the Pennsy bankruptcy and the drama that followed.  I don't follow the eastern roads to any extent, being mired in the SP and ATSF problems.

Mike

[Conrail Quality]

Hi N-railer,

    The term used by fieromike  "remember the pennsy went belly up?" is akin to the disastrous merger of the Pennsylvainia & New York Central railroads forming the new road Penn Central. Techincally, the Pennsy itself didn't go belly up but a couple of years after mergering with NYC it did big time. The merger took place in 1967 and by 1971 the company went bankrupt. When 1976 rolled around the U.S. government decided it would take a group of failing east coast roads and group them together under one name: Conrail. Penn Central got assorbed into this. Supossably ever letter in the name Conrail is suppose to represent the name of each road that was bought together to make this railroad. Maybe one Conrail fan will
post here to debunk this theory whether this is true or not?
                                          trainnutz


   
   

That's just a coincidence. Conrail is short for Conrail's legal name, the "Consolidated Rail Corporation". On some of the first repainted Conrail locomotives, Conrail was actually spelled "Con Rail", which the PR depeartment very quickly realized was not a good idea. Hence, we have "Conrail".

Timothy

[thirdrail]

Pennsy didn't have any passenger cars that looked like the Bachmann plus cars, either. The Model Power coach and combine are PRR prototypes, which are quite a bit longer. Currently there are no PRR passenger engines, steam or Diesel, but Intermountain should have a PRR FP7 shortly.

Or, you can check eBay.

[brokemoto]

As others have indicated, there is no PRR passenger steam that is in current production.  TRIX sold a K-4, but it is long out of production.  You can still find them at shows.  They are mediocre runners, but pretty good pullers.

Arnold sold an FP-7 in PRR paint, but it is long out of production.  B-mann sold an FP-9 in PRR paint, but it is not the most reliable power.

Life-Like, Con-Cor and Kato sold and sell PAs and E-8s in PRR paint.  C-C and LL sold E-7s in PRR paint.  The only one, at least of which I am aware, that is in current production is the LL E-8 and PA.  The Kato E-8s are recent production, and are still widely available.  You can find Kato PAs at shows.  The LL E-7 had a plastic frame (there was also an E-8 and PA similarly constructed).  They are still out there at shows.  You can find older production C-C at shows.  There is supposed to be a redesigned C-C PA out there, but it is not easy to find.

All of the PAs and E-units are larger engines and look silly pulling the B-mann shorties.  The PRR units lack the TrainFone antennas.  One of the detail manufacturers sells the brackets for the antennas and the Woodland Scenics foam cutter wire makes a good antenna.

Atlas sells an RS-3 in PRR paint.  You could change the number to a PRR passenger number.  MicroScale sells PRR decal sheets.  You would have to add the steam generator stacks, which J'n'J Trains sells.

I forget if PRR had passenger GP-7s or GP-9s, and what color the railroad painted them.  Atlas sells both, but I do not recall that they ever did any PRR passenger units.  They did  a freight GP-7 in PRR.  If PRR had passenger GP-7s, you could change the number and add the s/g stacks.  I do not know if PRR passenger GP-7s were DGLE or red, or if they had torpedo tubes.

All of the above road switchers lack the TrainFone antenna.  They would look allright pulling the B-mann shorties, as would the FP-9 or the IM FP-7, if it arrives, ever.

[ole]

I find the issue of dummy locomotives interesting, probably since they seem to be so rare. Even rarer is finding one in your favorite rail line.
I have 2 Model Power FA-2s in GN paint (awful colors) which were gutted of their motors. Stripping these old engines of their power plants is easy due to their design which lacks an integral gear set. I permanently coupled them back to back.
I also have Con Cor PA-1 and PB-1 dummys in GN colors which are very nicely painted; I believe these were available in PRR too. Bachmann had their F9A & F9B also available as dummies in the 70s. These are oversize (somebody couldn't figure out their scale ruler?) but can sit by themselves in the yard with no one being the wiser. Mine came in GN big sky blue but it was a terrible paint job so I stripped them and painted them for the CB&Q. Life Like made a set of GP-38-2s with one powered engine, a dummy and a caboose; limited railroads and too new for the PRR.
I did see a set of Arnold FP7/9s at the local club layout in PRR paint. They were very nice runners which is somewhat strange for such old engines. I asked the guy were they came from and he said somebody just walked in the door one day and donated them.
Lee in Tucson

[brokemoto]

LL sold its plastic frame FA in the green/orange GN paint.  I do not know if the MP had blue or green/orange.  If it had green/orange, you could always put the B on the powered chassis and use it to power the two dummy As.  The plastic frame FAs came with a powered A and dummy B, but the B shell will go onto the A chassis.  I forget if LL did GN when it issued the FAs in metal frame.  If not, the shells from the plastic frame power will go onto the metal frame chassis with a minimum of work.  The plastic frame power chassis was not bad for its time, but it is now dated.  One thing about it, though, it would pull every piece of rolling stock that you owned up a fifty per cent grade.

The old Arnold FP-7/FP-9 was a very good runner, especially considering its time.  It was noisy and did have a habit of shorting.  It had a metal shell, which gave it pretty good pulling power.  I still have one which I will still operate, it is that good.  Once the IM FP appears, I am assuming that it will supercede it.  The IM F units have always run well, and even though the FP-7 will have  a new chassis, I am assuming that it will be pretty good.

Model Power sells an FP-7 in PRR paint.  The 'hobbyist' version of it has an incorrect paint scheme, red single  pinstripe.  The 'trainset' version has the correct striping scheme, but the red is not the best (neither is the red too good on the B-mann FP-9).  Both versions of the MP run well, but employ dated construction methods.

LL sold an FP-whatever (some have asserted that it has both F-7 and F-9 features) with a plastic frame.  It was a good puller and a good runner, for its time, but is  now dated.  It came in PRR DGLE.  Some of the PRR FP-7s were DGLE.  I am not sure if it has a correct FP-7 number. 

Some of the paint schemes on the LL FP-whatevers were not the best.  LL also sold it painted for roads that did not have FP-7s, such as B&O and WM.  B&O had FP-7s that it acquired from the C&O after 1962, but B&O never painted them in the Blue/Grey scheme that is on the LL version.  LL also numbered the B&O version for a passenger F-3.  The B&O passenger F-3s were all early phase F-3s.

[N-Railer]

ok, so back to my initial question, I am a newbie and while I genuinely appreciate all of the help with this post I am getting quite lost in all of the "veteran" jargon.

to bring it back to a 4th grade level... ...it sounds like I need to create my own dummy.

to refresh the topic: I bought a Bachmann spectrum CSX dash-8 and I want to add second or third engine to pull the load...should I be looking for another dash or what other diesel engine would be appropriate to pair with mine, my ultimate plan is to add a sound decoder in the dummy so I would need a "real" engine with contacts to get the electrical right?


does anybody have a dead CSX engine they want to sell/donate? I  have checked ebay and they never come up broken it is almost always gently used or brand new, and I cannot bring myself to "gut" a perfectly good brand new engine     

[ole]

You are correct, these threads can sort of go off track in discussing small niches of the hobby. So back to your basics, you have two choices considering your lack of experience (to date): 1)go with a dummy or 2)another powered unit.
1) One or two dummy unit engines won't present any problem except limit the total number of cars you can pull (one or two less). But finding dummy units can be troublesome especially if you have to have it now. If ebay is your hobby shop, then put your favoritess on watch and be patient; summer can be a great time for deals but the selection is low. I waited over 18 months to find a GN Life Like E7; I ended up paying a new engine price for a used engine but now I have it and it is a great acquistion for me. Otherwise keep looking at the swap meets as I doubt your hobby shop would have much to choose from.
2) Get another powered unit the same as you have now. There has been discussion of matching engine speeds between different manufacturers of the same engines. Ideally, each engine in a multi-engine lash-up should run the same speed at the same voltage. But most don't but come close. So to avoid any problems, just run the same engines; put the 'fastest' engine on the lead to pull the train. Personally, I have not had any problems with mixing engines but then I don't have any traction tired (rubber bands on the driving axles) engines. I think that the traction tires offer the most potential troubles for speed matching as opposed to steel wheels.
Finally, this will really introduce you to the hobby: Strip, paint and decal the engines you buy to match your rail road.  That way you get a variety of engines not available to the general public but with the correct engine model in the correct colors.
Lee in Tucson