Bachmann Thomas & Friends in 2020

[Kemptown Branch]

You do make some really good points in here. I actually think that Bachmann could end up following your argument with this case. I just reel like if they are going to make them to the Tomix scale, it would have been smarter to choose different rolling stock like the coal wagon with load or the cargo car, just because the only thing different from Tomix that they would be making is Troublesome Truck #2 and the color scheme for Troublesome Truck #1. I also noticed that there are other people that want the same to happen. I did look at the 2002 catalog for Bachmann (it's still online), and they did make a fair amount of new toolings (not counting Thomas & Friends), but they still went with the Mainline toolings for the Troublesome Trucks. I also looked at the economic environment for the time, and it was in recession, so that could be why. I just have one question for you. If they do end up being Graham Farish size, would you still buy the new range?

It's so weird to see just how much cheaper everything was 17 years ago. Everything's only about a third of the price they are now.

EDIT: I'm sorry about this, but I am not quite finished yet. I have looked at Ebay several times for Tomix Thomas stuff in the past (the old range). They are always extremely expensive and I don't see a lot of people forking out the money to buy these models once the Bachmann Range gets on it's feet. All of the stuff in the picture and online right now is the reboot of the range. Good, right, because it's cheaper? I'm not so sure. The new range has had a lot of quality control issues. On this forum alone, BassTBone and douglas both have reported issues with the new James models not working for very long. BassTBone also said Tomix had been over-scaled, and with the nature of the post, it seems he thinks its not a good thing. Exile90 of BluePlasticTracks.com has said that the new Tomix stuff feels like it could derail at any time due to them being super light. He also said that Annie and Clarabel uncouple a lot for the same reason. He also brings up the issue of plastic wheels, which has been proven several times in the past to cause more issues (even with non-Thomas trains) with derailment and the spread of dirt along the rails. XtremeTrainz of YouTube has also reported issues with his James model not running as well as Thomas and Percy do. TrainTsarFun of YouTube has also had problems with his Tomix Thomas model, with it not even working right out of the package. There is also a video dedicated to him sorting out the problem. In several of his videos about Tomix Thomas trains, you can even see the cars derailing a lot due to lack of weight. Chaz has even said just how much the running of the Narrow Gauge products (they are just as small as the Tomix Range) is improved by the addition of metal wheels. I feel like, for a kid's line, there shouldn't be so many issues with the products right out of the package.

Bachmann has a lot of potential to make a far superior product if they aren't forced to be compatible with the Tomix Range. Bachmann more than likely will put metal wheels on their N Scale Thomas line, which is something they have done with every other Thomas and Friends item they have made, with the exception of the Peco recolors, but that's most likely because they are recolors of a different brand. Over time, as more products are released for this new range, people will likely see it as pointless to run Tomix models and Bachmann models together as the Tomix models will derail and uncouple more often. In addition, the Graham Farish models also already have metal wheels, so it wouldn't add to the cost to include metal wheels with wagon repaints that already have them. With the simple addition of 14+, they could make their models a lot more detailed as it will be considered "a scale model for adult collectors." 6 years ago, I emailed Bachmann about making an N Scale Thomas range, and they told me that it would not be good for them because the models would be too small for kids to handle, and that they had no plans for making a range anytime soon. Bachmann also will probably do correct coloring for their Thomas models: Tomix used yellow instead of gold, and it looks really off in my opinion. Seeing as people likely wouldn't mix the Tomix and Bachmann models by this point, Bachmann will have missed out on making the models accurately scaled to other N scale models, and people probably wouldn't appreciate having to keep their Thomas and non-Thomas models separate in order to keep things from looking off.

I feel like there are a lot of sound and economically smart decisions for Bachmann to leave Tomix the way they are and have their own, proper scaling for their N Scale Range. There are a lot of toolings that are distinctly Thomas in the HO scale range, and even the Mainline recolors look more like Thomas models than OO scale models produced today. The toolings for rolling stock in the Thomas range that are distinctly Thomas are the Red Coaches, Annie and Clarabel, The Mail Coaches, the Tankers, the Flatbeds, Emily's coaches, and Henrietta. I feel that having the other wagons based off of existing toolings is forgivable considering just how many new toolings already had to be made. Even if the Graham Farish toolings are used, I feel we can count on Bachmann to make them look like they are distinctly Thomas. They are a model train company and have been in business for several years, and I'm certain that they know how to make existing toolings look like something different just enough to have it be satisfactory and not look monotonous.

[TrainFan97]

Man, I really want to see the 2019 catalog.

[Chaz]

I'm surprised people are still posting in the 2019 thread, you would think more people would post in this thread instead. 

Anyway, in response to Trainman2001's post, personally I wouldn't mind AS much if they go in true British N scale, but I feel if that were the case, we would have at least seen what the troublesome trucks would have looked like in the catalog.  I think because they are just showing the HO models for illustrative purposes for the N scale models in the catalog as well as no price being shown is telling me that they will all likely be new toolings.  Probably why the second email response regarding the scale mentioned that they were not sure.  They will likely go with a scale on their own which could very well scale up with the Tomix models or come close like the Lima rolling stock models I have shown earlier.

I think because the models will be new toolings I think the motor issues that Tomix had previously will likely not carry on to the Bachmann models.  We will likely see them perform a lot better with a more modern motor.  The rolling stock will likely have metal wheels too, following the same track record as the slate wagons and the HO and large scale rolling stock.

I think while size was one of the biggest issues the large scale has to deal with and N scale wouldn't, pricing will probably still be a factor in what gets announced.  Large scale only announced James and Emily and I could honestly see the same happening for N scale depending on the prices.  The HO line got away with making a lot more tender engines, but that was a long time ago too when tooling costs seemed to be more manageable.  Last time the HO range announced any tender engines was Donald and Douglas, and that was because they were twins since Bill and Ben got announced at the same time too.  It doesn't help that they were announced almost a decade ago too.  And with Mattel behind the wheel, it makes me a lot less confident considering their track record since they bought the brand and continue to drastically change the prices behind models since 2013. 

So while I have my doubts on the quantity of what the range can make, I have no doubt that what they will make will be made in great quality.  And to me that's a far more important thing to consider than anything else if Bachmann really wants sales of this new range to take off.

[TrainFan97]

I honestly don't get why people were still posting in the 2019 thread, even a few weeks after this year's announcements already got posted.

Regarding HO recolors, I'm starting to think Sidney is overdue, but because of the 75th Anniversary, LBSC Thomas is a higher priority. Ever since Mattel's takeover, we've only gotten two new toolings in HO Scale, which were Oliver and Rosie. Hopefully, another company will buy the franchise; one that actually knows how to manage it properly, and Mattel is going down the toilet.

[rjmets41]

I honestly don't get why people were still posting in the 2019 thread, even a few weeks after this year's announcements already got posted.

Regarding HO recolors, I'm starting to think Sidney is overdue, but because of the 75th Anniversary, LBSC Thomas is a higher priority. Ever since Mattel's takeover, we've only gotten two new toolings in HO Scale, which were Oliver and Rosie. Hopefully, another company will buy the franchise; one that actually knows how to manage it properly, and Mattel is going down the toilet.

I don't know how many of you guys have seen this but, this is Bachmann last fall (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrkkJVVSqzE&t=398s). Basically, Bachmann is saying the market is not there to put out new toolings and mentions that Bachmann milks the Thomas and Friends line in order to help pay for its other projects. Don't be so quick to blame Mattel.

[Cheeky_ULP]

I honestly don't get why people were still posting in the 2019 thread, even a few weeks after this year's announcements already got posted.

Regarding HO recolors, I'm starting to think Sidney is overdue, but because of the 75th Anniversary, LBSC Thomas is a higher priority. Ever since Mattel's takeover, we've only gotten two new toolings in HO Scale, which were Oliver and Rosie. Hopefully, another company will buy the franchise; one that actually knows how to manage it properly, and Mattel is going down the toilet.

I don't know how many of you guys have seen this but, this is Bachmann last fall (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrkkJVVSqzE&t=398s). Basically, Bachmann is saying the market is not there to put out new toolings and mentions that Bachmann milks the Thomas and Friends line in order to help pay for its other projects. Don't be so quick to blame Mattel.

Most of us are more than aware of it, and it doesn't excuse Mattel from raising the prices on the license or approving/disapproving certain products and designs within the last few years. Prices are going up, but quality isn't (particularly had a few personal incidents with items not glued on properly) and despite said price increases, the brand just isn't quite feeling like to many Bachmann fans that it's getting the same love that it used to.

I don't understand why people are quick to defend a company that's losing money in the millions and are downright lying to stockholders in order to try and keep profits going back in early February via reporting a sudden adjusted profit. This isn't some super private secret disclosed from the public, it's a well known ongoing development in the last few months (if not years). This isn't some baseless jab or troll attempt at Mattel, it's a legitimate problem going on with their company as a whole. Thomas is in shaky hands, and indisputably so.

[Plow_Bender]

I don't know how many of you guys have seen this but, this is Bachmann last fall (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrkkJVVSqzE&t=398s). Basically, Bachmann is saying the market is not there to put out new toolings and mentions that Bachmann milks the Thomas and Friends line in order to help pay for its other projects. Don't be so quick to blame Mattel.

Saying that Bachmann milks their Thomas & Friends line to pay for everything else they do is basically like saying they use the range as a crutch to get them out of trouble with collectors of their other products.  That's pretty harsh if you ask me...  Jack clearly says that the Thomas & Friends range helps to "subsidize" (if you don't know what that means, look it up) all the other ranges that Bachmann offers.  It's no different than Bachmann taking profits from ranges like HO or N and investing said profits back into the Thomas range.  All the scales Bachmann produces share a common backbone, and regardless what brings in better sales the money all goes to the same place.

Then we get on to the topic of new tooling's, which is not going to happen simply for the fact the cost of everything has gone completely out of control.  As another member mentioned in a previous post, the prices for the ranges (or HO at least) have gone up over 200% within the last 10 years, and it's ridiculous to pay over $120 for a model that you could once pick up at your hobby shop in yesteryears for only $35.  That was the main cause of Hornby's downfall as the models they produced were too expensive for what they were, considering some of their tooling's had been around since the 1950's.  While I don't know if this price issue was caused by Mattel's doing or not, I'm in no way pointing fingers at them.  Getting back to Bachmann and present day, I can honestly say (as will others I'm sure) that models such as Thomas and/or Percy are not worth $100 for what little they have to offer.

At the end of the day you have Bachmann trying to produce what little they can, while dealing with the uprising production costs and throwing money away trying to afford a license to produce the Thomas ranges.  Then you have Mattel over in the corner losing their shirt because of their own recklessness, and "we're" suppose to feel sorry for them?   Furthermore, I just read last night Mattel has yet again had another setback recently with an 18% stock drop, claiming that the toys aren't selling.  I know Mattel clearly has a problem, but Firemen have problems all the time.  Ever seen one throw gas on it?

-Rusty

[JLK2707]

Just yet a great point!

[Anthony P2]

I don't know how many of you guys have seen this but, this is Bachmann last fall (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TrkkJVVSqzE&t=398s). Basically, Bachmann is saying the market is not there to put out new toolings and mentions that Bachmann milks the Thomas and Friends line in order to help pay for its other projects. Don't be so quick to blame Mattel.

Saying that Bachmann milks their Thomas & Friends line to pay for everything else they do is basically like saying they use the range as a crutch to get them out of trouble with collectors of their other products.  That's pretty harsh if you ask me...  Jack clearly says that the Thomas & Friends range helps to "subsidize" (if you don't know what that means, look it up) all the other ranges that Bachmann offers.  It's no different than Bachmann taking profits from ranges like HO or N and investing said profits back into the Thomas range.  All the scales Bachmann produces share a common backbone, and regardless what brings in better sales the money all goes to the same place.

Then we get on to the topic of new tooling's, which is not going to happen simply for the fact the cost of everything has gone completely out of control.  As another member mentioned in a previous post, the prices for the ranges (or HO at least) have gone up over 200% within the last 10 years, and it's ridiculous to pay over $120 for a model that you could once pick up at your hobby shop in yesteryears for only $35.  That was the main cause of Hornby's downfall as the models they produced were too expensive for what they were, considering some of their tooling's had been around since the 1950's.  While I don't know if this price issue was caused by Mattel's doing or not, I'm in no way pointing fingers at them.  Getting back to Bachmann and present day, I can honestly say (as will others I'm sure) that models such as Thomas and/or Percy are not worth $100 for what little they have to offer.

At the end of the day you have Bachmann trying to produce what little they can, while dealing with the uprising production costs and throwing money away trying to afford a license to produce the Thomas ranges.  Then you have Mattel over in the corner losing their shirt because of their own recklessness, and "we're" suppose to feel sorry for them?   Furthermore, I just read last night Mattel has yet again had another setback recently with an 18% stock drop, claiming that the toys aren't selling.  I know Mattel clearly has a problem, but Firemen have problems all the time.  Ever seen one throw gas on it?

-Rusty

I couldn't have put this better myself! Models are so expensive to produce. Mr. Lynch has a point, they can only produce so many models with roadnames that they know are going to sell because there will be a higher turnover for them. Look at the brand Rapido, they have a niche market for models that aren't/can't be/won't be produced by manufactures such as Bachmann because there is such a small demand for them, then they charge a higher price for the model. They are expensive for a reason. For example, take a look at their Stirling Single model. I have one myself and its a gorgeous model. Rapido was willing to produce this, but when they did, they said "Ok we'll produce this model, but we'll have to charge a lot for it." As consumers we said "ok!" The price tag was to offset their tooling and manufacturing costs especially since they're not producing as many models as a bigger name manufacturer would.

Since Thomas does subsidize a bunch of other lines, I truly believe Bachmann have a bunch of new toolings and projects they want to do, but in order t get to that point, they need to sell some produces that use existing tooling already with roadnames/paint schemes (i.e. Red Rosie, sodor scrap co truck) because they know there's a demand and those products will sell. I'm actually kind of surprised they haven't done an Original Thomas or Original James yet...but they're probaby waiting for another significant anniversary again like the 75th anniversary or something.

*I probably threw in a lot of business jargen while writing this...the perks being a marketing graduate student ...so if there are any words that need explaining, let me know!

[TrainFan97]

If we were to get a second engine recolor in HO Scale to join LBSC Thomas, I doubt we'd still get Sidney just yet, since the second engine recolor to release with LBSC Thomas would make much more sense if it was Black James, since both of those recolors are from The Adventure Begins. Green Thomas and Black James would be perfect recolors to celebrate the 75th Anniversary. Bachmann has the toolings for them, and you can use them to better recreate scenes from the special.

Hopefully, Red Rosie will be in stock this summer, since her image is already there. Now that 'Arry and Bert are discontinued, the next engines to go might be original Diesel, and original Rosie. Diesel is now available with a face more suitable for his character, and Rosie is being made in her better livery, complete with lamp.

[JLK2707]

Just yet another great point!

[TrainFan97]

I've given up hope for Bachmann to make Stepney or Daisy in HO Scale, since the market for new toolings has dwindled.

When prices go up, and quality goes down, this type of inflation needs a term, if it doesn't have one already. For example, "shrinkflation" is when portions get shrunk, but not the prices.

[MoarCrossovers]

What if, to save costs, Bachmann decides to make Smudger next year?

[Zekeism]

What if, to save costs, Bachmann decides to make Smudger next year?

Barely anyone will buy it though? Just a waste of time making a character who appeared in just one episode.

[Angelob6660]

What if, to save costs, Bachmann decides to make Smudger next year?

Barely anyone will buy it though? Just a waste of time making a character who appeared in just one episode.

Plus we don't really know if he was a real locomotive or someone that Duke made up.