1:20.3 questions - Bachmann, other companies? Slightly larger scale?

[sfcorp]

Hi Bach Man,

I am searching for modern trains, train cars, and train tracks in the closest scale to 1:18 , of which I am a collector of everything in that wide ranging model scale.  The only thing I realize I am missing in my diorama are trains.  With some research, I discovered that Bachmann makes 1:20.3 size scale trains, which I think would be closest to go along with the 1:18 scale.

First of all, would I be accurate in my assumption that for example, a 1:18 diecast model car, would fit pretty darn close to scale on the top of a 1:20.3 flat car?  If not, is there a train scale even closer to 1:18 than 1:20.3 ?  I've read a tiny bit about an "F scale" that may be exact, but I'm vague on info on that scale.

Let's say 1:20.3 it is the closest scale I'll get to 1:18 for trains to fit into my diorama.  Doesn't anyone make more modern trains for 1:20.3 scale?  I've seen an Amtrak engine, but it was very expensive and seemingly custom made.

So now that I've said what my purposeful intention is, for display in a scale diorama, I do not need working engines inside of them so they can be empty on the inside.   Is there any way I can get access to engines like these, with no engines inside?  I am willing to buy damaged, used, or gutted modern engines in this scale.

Lastly, what is the name of the exact type of track I would need for 1:20.3 scale trains to sit/ride on for display only?

THANK YOU VERY MUCH  !!

I hope you can answer all my questions, Mr. Bach Man !

[the Bach-man]

Dear SF,
The only commercial 1:20.3 standard gauge train manufacturer that I'm familiar with is here:
http://www.crofutandironcreek.com/
The trains are not modern, however. All of our 1:20.3 models are of narrow gauge prototypes.
Have fun!
the Bach-man

[sfcorp]

Is it possible to find someone who would make modern ones?  Or anyone selling used trains of this scale.

[Hunt]

Is it possible to find someone who would make modern ones?  Or anyone selling used trains of this scale.

Based on the Bach-man's reply, your next step would seem to be to use the Iron Creek Shops Contact Information in the link he gave you.

Also suggest posting your requirements on the MY Large Scale Forum

[az2rail]

I spend a weekend searching 1;20.3 and larger web sites, and I did not find much for larger than 1:20.3. There were a couple for 1:18, but they are, as you found out, custom made and expensive.

Bachmann and Accucraft seem to be the best shots for larger than G equipment, but they are to small for what you appear to be looking for. Bachmann's equipment is narrow gauge, and when modeled,  modern engines and rolling stock would be much larger. In my opinion, a 1:20.3 narrow gauge flat car would look small for a modern 1:18 auto. But that's just me, and of course it is all about how it looks to "you".

The correct track width for modern stuff would be 70.64mm, where 1.20.3 narrow gauge is 45mm. So your track would considerably larger, and 1:18 would be even larger. You would probably have to hand lay your track.

You might try some other forums, like My Large scale. and ask those guys. Someone there might have better answers.

Bruce

[tac]

I spend a weekend searching 1;20.3 and larger web sites, and I did not find much for larger than 1:20.3. There were a couple for 1:18, but they are, as you found out, custom made and expensive.

Bachmann and Accucraft seem to be the best shots for larger than G equipment, but they are to small for what you appear to be looking for. Bachmann's equipment is narrow gauge, and when modeled,  modern engines and rolling stock would be much larger. In my opinion, a 1:20.3 narrow gauge flat car would look small for a modern 1:18 auto. But that's just me, and of course it is all about how it looks to "you".

The correct track width for modern stuff would be 70.64mm, where 1.20.3 narrow gauge is 45mm. So your track would considerably larger, and 1:18 would be even larger. You would probably have to hand lay your track.

You might try some other forums, like My Large scale. and ask those guys. Someone there might have better answers.

Bruce

Well, I post on MLS, and I can tell you that a bunch of very experienced modellers are building a few F-scale GN Northerns.  This task has so far taken them over two years, and the results are not only spectacular, but expensive, as you seem to have noted.

Sadly, in model railways, bigger = more expensive, and MUCH bigger, as you seem to want on the cheap, is MUCH more expensive, whether or not it actually works.

Add to that the sheer size of an F-scale car, even an older style 50 foot boxcar is over 31 inches long and 9 inches high, and a pretty average diesel locomotive like an SD45 is simply gigantic - 40 inches long for a start.... 

Here in UK we actually model in Gauge 3, which is the nearest documented scale to waht you want.  Gauge 3 is to a linear scale of 1:22.6, and runs on track that is 64mm gauge.  Most of the models are live-steam, coal-fired and scale items of extraordinary cost - think around $15K for a Pennsy K4.

There IS a company in the US who makes a few cars in your F-scale, but you want custom-built models 1/18th, a scale that nobody uses in model railroads, and for that, Sir, you are going to have to dig very deeply indeed.

Good luck -

tac
www.ovgrs.org 

[JerryB]

The size difference between 1:20.3 scale and 1:18 scale is over 11% in linear dimensions and ~30% in terms of 3d 'bulk'. Those differences will be very noticeable, especially on a diorama where every item is subject to close scrutiny. Add to that the fact that most commonly available 1:20.3 scale rolling stock and engines are narrow gauge prototypes from an era that virtually ended in the first half of the 20th century, and it all adds up to not being a satisfactory solution for your 1:18 scale modern day diorama.

As a suggestion, consider doing a very small bit of track (a siding) with a single rail car being loaded / unloaded. You can purchase readily available rail and spikes and use hand cut ties. Hand spike a section of rail to a gauge of 3.14" (the correct gauge for 1:18 scale standard gauge), then build (or have built) a flat car of a design commensurate with the era you're attempting to model. Flat cars are among the easiest to build. The biggest problem will be wheel sets, trucks and couplers, but there are numerous commercial and home based model makers who would be capable of and happy to custom make these items for reasonable costs. The fact that this stuff is destined for a static display would significantly cut the costs as compared to actual operating stuff.

I realize this doesn't provide the engine you are asking about, but it does allow accurate portrayal of a railroad siding where something is being loaded / unloaded and keeps the costs down. In real life the engine would only show up when the rail car is being delivered or collected, so that non-operational part would also be prototypical.

If the presence of an engine is critical to your planned diorama, the internal combustion (mostly diesel) switch engines from the 1940s and later are relatively easier to build from plastic sheet and shapes as compared to a steam engine or large road engine. Trucks and couplers are among the biggest issues, but again, much easier when being powered or capable of actual operation is not required.

On edit: I am currently working on a static diorama requiring some special construction. I own a 1:24 scale model of Westside lumber Co. Shay locomotive #15, bought before 1:20.3 became popular. All my operational LS railroad models are 1:20.3 scale and the 1:24 scale Shay looks out of place on the layout. I'm currently building a display case with a couple of feet of 1.5" gauge (the correct gauge for 3' narrow gauge at 1:24 scale) track, and will populate this diorama with other 1:24 scale vehicles, structures and figures. Because of the availability of 1:24 scale items, this is easier than your chosen 1:18 scale, but the concept is the same.

Just a suggestion: Your mileage, ability and interest may vary! 

Happy RRing,

Jerry