Beginner needs help

[jimdavis88]

I have spent many hours on the Internet reading blogs and I have enough information to now be thoroughly confused.  I'm new to railroading and want to set up a G train & track in my basement. I plan to put a 6" shelf close to the ceiling and it will only be a simple loop with no intersections.  From my reading I understand that I must use at least a 4'Radius corner to handle diesels locomotives and look realistic. My room is 42' x 12' and I plan two 4'R corners  on the one end, and the other end will be a 6'R ½ circle.
My questions:
1. Is my understanding so far correct? Is a 6" shelf the minimum size I can put up?
2. Since its indoors, should I use steel or brass. Brass is much cheaper but I heard it requires a lot of cleaning? What do you suggest for indoors?
3. I don't want to get into bending flex track, so can I buy 4'R & 6'Radius corners pre made in both brass and steel?
Any other suggestions to this new railroad modeler will be greatly appreciated.
Jim

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Hi Jim and welcome to a fun hobby.  I am sure you will get many helpful answers besides mine.

Most trains do not look that realistic on four foot radius, and six foot would be better if you can get away with it.  I wouldn't worry too much about realism on the curves, especially on a ceiling layout.

Question 1.  What you can get away with in shelf width depends a lot on overhang when locomotives or long passenger or freight cars go thru a corner.  my best advice it to set up a Test section of track on the floor and run your train thru it and your longest car to see if overhang will be a serious problem. You may need to go wider.  Some of our guys with shelf layouts will have much better advice than I can give you.

Question 2.  If you can afford it go with stainless steel track as it will stay cleaner longer. I f not go with the brass.  Since it is a ceiling layout, I would recommend investing in a good track cleaning car no matter what track you use.  Bachmann makes great brass track, but it is best not to use the Bachmann steel alloy track.

Question 3.  I know for sure you can get brass track in the size curves you need and straights in several lengeths. Get the longest straight sections that will fit your situation.  The fewer rail joints you have the better.  I also suggest using rail clamps for your track joints, as they are far better than the joiners that come on the track.  Corroded rail joints will be a majjor problem over time.

If you will be using diesels use the kind with four wheel trucks rather than those with six wheel trucks as they will lo0ok much better on the tight curves. 

Have fun in your new hobby and don't be afraid to ask questions!!



Loco Bill

[Chuck N]

Bill, I rarely disagree with you, but since he is building his layout indoors, there should not be any corrosion.  Regular rail joiners should be fine.  If he was going outside, that would be different.

I would recommend cable ties to hold the track sections together,  unless the track comes with screws in the joiners.

Chuck

[Joe Zullo]

Loco Bill,

You do realize that jimdavis88 wrote: I plan two 4'R corners  on the one end, and the other end will be a 6'R ½ circle.

Now he may have written it incorrectly, but a 4 foot radius is an 8 foot diameter circle and a 6 foot radius is a 12 foot diameter circle. Surely that is an easy enough curve for almost anything!

[armorsmith]

Well, I suppose I will enter the fray. 

In principal I agree with most of what Bill said, and I agree with Chuck that indoors the standard rail joiners will be more than adequate.

As for the track sizing, be careful here.  There is no such thing as a 12' circle of track, Aristo and USA both list an 11.5' diameter circle. Even here, this is a tight fit as the actual center line diameter of the track is 135.827" (11'-3 13/16") and you add to that the length of a tie (half a tie for each side of the circle) +/- 3 1/2" and your outside diameter of track is 11'-7 5/16".  That leaves you from the edge of the tie to the wall (assuming the 12' is exact) about 2 5/16".  That is not much for overhang on longer passenger cars or loco pilots.  Here is the link Greg E. posted on another site for the Aristo track information. 

http://members.westnet.com.au/susprog/AristoTrack.htm

As for using zip ties to hold the track together, I see no reason to not attach the track to the roadbed as being in doors expansion/contraction will not be an issue.

Bob C.

[NarrowMinded]

I will jump in as well, you do need to make sure of the over hang of the cars on curves, 6" is pushing it.

I will also mention that many people grow bored of their simple ceiling layout and decide to add flat building fronts and a tunnel in a corner, all of these additions become harder if you've pushed everything against the walls as close as possible.

As for track, joiners and cleaning the track, for a trouble free setup use the best you can afford, time spent counting saved money will be lost in time repairing track issues.

pull a cleaning car with your train and use good materials and you will be happy you did.

NM-Jeff

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Sorry guys I scrambled radius and diameter!!     Totally my screw up on that!!!

As for joiners well.....
I know of a club that maintains a large ceiling layout for a business, they have had issues with some rail joiners loosening up and failing to conduct for whatever reason, maybe because they run six hours or more a day. Their joints with clamps have never failed for them.  It was with brass track. I have also seen what happens when a diesel derails but the rear truck remained running.  It not only digs deep grooves in the track, but also ruined the loco wheels as well.  I used clamps on part of my indoor RR and regular joiners failed in two places over 5 years, naturally in the worst possible places. I have since switched to battery power and of course have no trouble at all and don't even clean the track anymore either on my indoor or outdoor RR.  I keep one loop indoors with clamps for when friends come who do not have battery powered locomotives, then it is back to cleaning the track for just the DC guys.  My only point on joiners is that if you can afford clamps, you will never have a problem with conductivity, and regular track cleaning is very important no matter which way you go.   I also still feel the 4 wheel truck diesels look way more realistic on our tight curves than the six wheel types. Still my humble opinions for the reasons stated.

As I said to Jim, you guys would chime in with your thoughts!  I'm glad I was right!

Jim, have fun with your trains!!

[jimdavis88]

I'm getting really good information that is helping me a lot. Thanks everyone. I can see its easy to make new RR friends.