WOW thanks for the wealth of knowledge Bill. It took me awhile to learn how to lay track in HO and get it wright. I finally learned to stop being in a hurry to get the trains running and take my time and do it right. Now my HO trains can run for hours with out derailing. Don't worry I won't give up, I'll apply your advice, do some more research and get back at it. I'm heading to a couple of train shows one here in Cahrleston SC this coming weekend, the other in Myrtle Beach the following weekend. I know there is one in Atlanta coming up but I can't make that one. Anyway,Thanks again Bill.