I think many of you are overlooking the real problem. While working in Richmond, IN a while ago I visited a brand new hobby shop in the downtown area. We talked about a new steam locomotive I was interested in but the owner said he won't even carry it in stock. Why? because his "wholesale" price from the distributor was HIGHER than what the mail order places were selling it for. The problem is not the hobby shops but the manufacturers who have different price structures for different customers. This puts the locals guys at a distinct disadvantage. If all retailers paid the same price for their products they could compete with mail order. Bachmann is guilty of this. Just look a Trainworlds prices in Model Railroader and the banner on top of the page: "Bachmann's Top Dealer". I plead guilty of using mail order when I can buy a new Bachmann American Freedom GS4 for $100 less than the local hobby shop. Sales tax and shipping can't make up that much difference and waiting is not a problem. I have to wait for the week-end to go to the hoibby shop anyway so if I order on a Monday I usually have it by the week-end or following Monday. The mail order guys have quick shipping down to a science.