Military Railroads/Was future of On30

[Kevin S.]

Rather than hijack the future of On30 thread I will start this one.

I am surprised Bachmann has not produced on the WW I trench locomotives in On30. This would tap multiple markets, one of which is the not inconsiderable military modeling market.

The Baldwin 4-6-0s that were used for the 2 ft . trench railways were sold all over the place after the war, both in Europe and in the U.S. The Germans always had cool looking locomotives.

This type of locomotive would appeal to the kit bashers, the military modelers, and the international narrow gauge modeler.

[Skarloey Railway]

Scale is one problem. In the US O scale is 1:48, in the UK it's 1:43, and in Continental Europe I believe it's 1:45.

Also, so far as I am aware the American 2'gauge locos produced for service in WW1 didn't operate in the US.

And as far as military modellers go, they are, I believe, mostly into static displays so the cost of a working model would be a bit excessive for their needs.

[Kevin S.]

All of your statements are true except for the Baldwin's coming home to operate in the U.S.

Several went to military camps for training and others went to logging railroads.

I just cannot locate the links for photos of these 4-6-0s in operation in the U.S.

I would have to think some military modelers would want some and it might get a few of them to have a layout with their static displays.

Just a thought. 1/45 might be a good compromise size.

[Skarloey Railway]

It would have been odd if none had operated in the US, since I assume they would have still been building them up 'til the Armistice so a number would never have even shipped to Europe. In the UK the Baldwin 4-6-0 saw the most post-war use with about a dozen (he said hazily) working on about 4 railways, including some that were regauged. Outside of them there were a trio of Baldwin 2-6-2s (though they saw very little service) and at least one Baldwin diesel loco. Given the number of locos available post WW1 it's a negligible number.
It is a surprise that no WW1 loco ended up in Maine, is it not?
The reputation of the Baldwin 4-6-0 in the UK was pretty poor. A combination of crews being unfamiliar with US practise and rough riding in reverse.

[Royce Wilson]

The American trench engines(2-6-2T) did operate in the U.S. after the war. I can't recall the name of the lumber companies in Virginia at this time.

The narrow gauge & short line gazette had an article by Mallory H.Ferrell,about 2 foot lumber operations in the south.

Royce

[Hamish K]

I too would like to see WW1 narrow gauge items made. To my mind the obvious locomotive for Bachmann to make would be the 2-6-2t. Alco delivered a batch of these to the UK army and, when the US entered the war a very similar (though not identical 2-6-2t) was chosen as the standard US steam locomotive. They were built by various makers, including Baldwin. A number of these did operate in the US after the war. Earlier Baldwin had made a 4-6-0t for the UK, these were of similar dimensions to a 4-6-0t made by the British  maker Hunslett, but of typical American appearance with American features. Hunslett had not been able to build the locos fast enough.

Another loco Bachmann could consider would be the Baldwin gas mechanical, which was also used by the US in WW1. This could replace the former Davenport in the On30 range.

Scale would only be an issue if Bachmann were to aim at European and UK existing narrow gauge modellers who use 1:43 or 1:45. If they aim at American modellers and international modellers who use On30 (On30 is quite popular in the  UK,  Europe, Australia and other places) then they would stick to 1:48.

One possibility would be for a separate international range made to 1:45. I suggest 1:45 as, being in between 1:48 and 1:43 it would less obviously different and some modellers (but not all) would be prepared to mix. The small size of the WW1 prototypes could assist in making them look OK with 1:48 scale models. The On30 1:48 range would of course continue alongside such a range. In this case a range of WW1 locos from different countries could be produced.

OK I am dreaming, but why not?

At least make an On30 (1:48) scale 2-6-2t. With centenary of WW1 this would be good way of commemorating it

Hamish

[Kevin S.]

Given that many of these locomotives had U.S.A. or U.S. Army lettered on the side tanks, an actual accurately produced model would appeal to many for patriotic reasons - it might sell well in a train set or to the collectors.

Good idea about the 100 year anniversary of the WW I conflict.

[ebtnut]

The Lost River RR in Virginia/West Virginia operted a pair of ex-Army 2-6-2's for a couple of years in logging service.  The line connected with the standard gauge Winchester and Wardensville RR, which is today the Winchester and Western.  The line from Gore, VA to Wardensville was pulled up many years ago. 

[rayport]

Many WW1 locos of English/French/German/USA origin ended up on narrow gauge railroads around the world. Brazil has/had a wonderful collection from most nations in near origin and after quite creative modification condition. Everyone is right that they would make a great addition to the ON30 line. Forwishing to follow up on this topic, there have been a number of articles on prototype and model interest published by the Narrow Gauage and Shortline Gazette which has also published Richard Dunn's book "Narrow Guage To No Man's Land" (now available from www.bobhayden.com). Similar books have also been published on the English, French, and German WW1 NG railroads a good source for these is the fabulous London store Motor Books (www.motorbooks.co.uk/).

I suspect that Hamish is right in his excellent post, we are dreaming - but some days dreams do come true.

[Skarloey Railway]

One of the Baldwin 4-6-0s is still alive and well. 778 was re-imported from India some years ago and has had a major restoration.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Baldwin_Inaugural_run.jpg

[Royce Wilson]

These small engines would go very well with the new 18' freight cars.

Royce

[Kevin S.]

From Wikipedia - info with photos of some various two foot trench railways, including American 2-6-2ts and Baldwin 4-6-0s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trench_railways

Scroll down to the bottom and you'll find three photos of the Alco 2-6-2Ts in service after the war. Two on preservation railways and one at a construction site in Michigan in 1921.

[Kevin S.]

This link will take you to a downloadable PDF about the Alco 2-6-2s produced for the War Department for WW I.

This locomotive might make lots of people happy. Neat actual WW I locomotive but the 2-6-2 mechanism would make great kitbash fodder.

Here's the link:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/On30/files/BLM_01/126p31Alco%20Copy.pdf

[Larry Green]

Slightly out of scale to this topic I know, but possibly of interest to followers of this thread--go to roundhouse-eng.com for info on a live steam model of the Alco 2-6-2 being discussed here.

Mine is scheduled for production next month.

Larry

[rich19]

Hey

I already suggested the baldwin 4-60 and 2-6-2 some time ago in this forum but so far, there was no reaction from the bachmann yet.

These locomotive are indeed globally deployable - that's the key argument in my opinion.

But as already discussed, in what scale? I also see 1:45 as a nice compromise to satisfy both american (1:48) and European (1:43,5) scales.

Besides being a Gazette subscriber, I also subscribe to the French magazine "Voie Libre". I highly recommend this magazine also to US readers: there is an English version available for i-pad users and its articles are not confined to France. They ran many interesting articles about the aforementioned Baldwins - both prototype and model ones.

By the way: there are HOn3 models by Victor Scale Models.

Snowy greetings from Austria

Rich