1800s Rolling Stock?

[CNE Runner]

I have just completed my 8th (or is it the 9th?) Bachmann Old West gondola (Item # 43-1025-01) and am again wondering why the major suppliers don't offer rolling stock of this era. Installing coupler/coupler boxes, new trucks, brake wheel, paint, decals, and weathering proves you can make a purse out of a sow's ear (albeit a cheap one). I find myself "haunting" model railroad shows and eBay to obtain rolling stock that should be readily available...on par with the quality of steam/diesel kits. Bachmann already has given us their excellent American 4-4-0s (I have two...and Mr. Bachmann how about offering some of the earlier woodburning engines with sound and DCC?).

Yes, there are craftsman kits on the market that portray this time period (LaBelle, BTS among others); but these are craftsman kits that require skill and considerable time. All the structures, on my layout, are of the wooden - craftsman - variety so I am well acquainted with this skill level. Why should I look in Model Railroader and see a fair number of truss-rod cars for HOn3 and virtually none for HO? I was informed that HOn3 cars cannot be added to my fleet by virtue of adding HO trucks because the entire car is scaled differently...rats!

Mr. Bachmann: You already have the dies and molds for these cars...why not upgrade them and offer them again? Roundhouse/MDC/Horizon Hobbies: why did you discontinue making kits for this time period? Accurail, Bowser, Walthers: don't we have enough 40' box cars and reefers?

Thanks for letting me "let off steam"...as you can tell this is one of my pet peeves. Now I guess I will have to assemble that BTS flatcar I've been moving to the bottom of the pile.

[ebtnut]

Most folks want to model either what they see out there in the real world (i.e., modern stuff) or they model what they remember from when they were about 10 years old.   The latter reason is why those of us approaching codger-dom model the steam-diesel transition era.  Pre-1900 modeling is a small niche, and probably not one that is going to draw a lot of major manufaturing interest.  There have been some selection of models over the years - Mantua had cars to go with the "General", and Bachmann makes the Golden Spike locos.  IIRC, MDC/Roundhouse also did some early cars as well.  Granted, it would be great if Bachmann took the Spectrum mech from the IF On30 4-4-0 and did a "William Mason" or such, but don't hold your  breath.

[CNE Runner]

EBTnut,

You are probably correct...there simply isn't enough interest (read: customers) to make production of late 19th century trains worthwhile. Perhaps I should be thankful that Bachmann was willing to introduce a well-made and reliable 4-4-0. I can live with the fact that the Bachmann Spectrum American locomotive was actually produced after the turn of the century. I guess I just find the 1880s to be an exciting time of railroading in the U.S. Small, light and beautiful engines pulling short mixed trains (frequently) through the bucolic countryside of the times...iron rails and iron men. Thanks for replying...now I'll go tear the trucks off that Bachmann gondola.

Ray

[Yampa Bob]

Athearn/Roundhouse offers 34' Overtons and 50' Overlands, both with clerestory roofs, that look great behind a vintage locomotive. The distributor is Horizon Hobbies, you might check their site for current availability.

I have 2 sets of each, the quality is very good, although lacking a bit in detail.

Model Power/Mantua has a line of vintage cars, but delivery is sporadic. I had some of their cars on back order for over a year and finally cancelled the order.

[the Bach-man]

Dear CNE,
I'll pass along your request.
Happy Holidays!
the Bach-man

[CNE Runner]

Bach-man,

Thanks for taking the time to pass on my suggestion. It seems there is a market niche that might prove profitable. I love those Spectrum 4-4-0s!! How about a Mogul to match? [Are we ever satisfied?]

Regards,
Ray

[CNE Runner]

Athearn/Roundhouse offers 34' Overtons and 50' Overlands, both with clerestory roofs, that look great behind a vintage locomotive. The distributor is Horizon Hobbies, you might check their site for current availability.

I have 2 sets of each, the quality is very good, although lacking a bit in detail.

Model Power/Mantua has a line of vintage cars, but delivery is sporadic. I had some of their cars on back order for over a year and finally cancelled the order.

Thanks for the suggestion Yampa Bob. I have a Roundhouse/MDC set of 34' Overton cars that I have painted and lettered for the Newburgh, Dutchess & Connecticut RR. Years ago you used to be able to purchase an interior kit for these cars...but no longer. I haven't had adequate chance to examine the Mantua cars although they look much more "toy-like" than the Roundhouse units. AHM and IHC used to produce some fairly good old time cars...alas they are also in the past.

An earlier post (from the Bach-man) indicated that he would "pass it on" to the powers that be. Given the scarcity of products, in this era, Bachmann might have a good product line on their hands (especially if they produce cars as good as their American 4-4-0s). Again thanks and I'll take a closer look at your Mantua suggestion.

[Yampa Bob]

Runner,

On a trip last year, I found 30+ original Athearn "Blue Box" and MDC Roundhouse vintage coach and freight car kits in shops along the way.  Some had the original price ($1.95 to $2.50) still on the box, others were remarked at $6.95.

They were "gathering dust" on shelves, and I was glad to get them, dust and all.

Check around for small out of the way hobby shops. The way to find them is to pick and search for a city "Chamber of Commerce" for addresses and phone numbers.

"Thar's gold in them thar shops" 

Good luck

[Will_Annand]

I too am after 1880s rolling stock and steamers, my scale of choice is N.

I don't know about customer base... everytime I ask about a product I get told they are out of stock by the manufacturer.. unless they only make a couple, they seem to sell.

Right now, only Athearn and Bachmann make the RTR rolling stock, and Bachmann does not sell theirs separate, only in train sets.

N Scale Supply makes flat, box and stock cars in kits that look great.

Motive power is where we are let down. The Bachmann 4-4-0 line is nice to look at, but reliability is an issue. I have 4 here and 3 sit idle becuase they don't run...

Only the little Atlas 2-6-0 Mogul runs like a dream. It is on my list to add an NCE decoder and make it DCC.

I would love to see Bachmann upgrade their 4-4-0s to Spectrum quality and make them DCC ready/equipped.

[richG]

Removed. Too much info about other company products.
Rich

[hminky]

"Why should I look in Model Railroader and see a fair number of truss-rod cars for HOn3 and virtually none for HO?"

Most narrow gaugers don't model the 1800's they model the 1930-1940 period specifically in Colorado. The HOn3 cars represent post 1903 generally. There is very little 1880's HOn3 equipment available.

There is a large narrow gauge market in HOn3.

Harold

[CNE Runner]

I was surprised to see this older thread still active. RichG, that photographer's car looks great (whether or not one actually existed); but I caution you about the complexity of such a kit. I have built older Varney kits that included castings, carvings and paper overlays. These kits are definitely not for someone who isn't well-grounded in advanced craftsman techniques...do not confuse these kits with laser-cut versions...these are much, much more difficult.

Will, good luck finding 1880s kits in N-scale. Much of what we have on the market (I am referring to 19th century HO kits) was produced in the 1970s and 80s. N-scale was in its infancy then - so the pickings are pretty slim...times are changing though.

Yampa Bob: as always you are a fount of knowledge and are helpful...you are one of the contributors who make this forum as good as it is. I have 15 or 20 MDC/Roundhouse kits that I overspray and redecorate with dry transfer sets from Clover House. The major problem is the MDC kits are actually models of cars that were produced after the turn of the century (and prior to WWI)...simply put they are too large. I recently bought (rescued?) a Mantua horse car. After some painting, re-wheeling and re-coupling it turned into a nice little car. According to my HO scale ruler it measures out at 27' which is correct for the 1880s. The difference in size between the Roundhouse cars (36') and the Mantua (27') really shows up when they are mixed.

Harold: We "batted" this topic around some on the Model Railroader forum recently. The HOn3 market was small and constituted a "fringe element" of the hobby until kits and RTR began to appear on the scene. Furthermore, Bachmann almost singlehandedly produced interest in On3 because they began producing excellent locomotives and cars (are you still listening Mr. Bach-Man?). I honestly think the notion "...if you build it - they will come" applies to 19th century model railroading as well. It is hard to build up interest (read that as "market") if there is little, to no, products offered within the gendre.

So what is the answer? We will do what legions of past modelers have done and "make due". I will continue to modify/redecorate rolling stock that is close to my modeling era. I will continue to build a few BTS kits. I will continue to check out the Bittercreek Models website to see what their rolling stock offerings will be. And, last - but not least, I will continue to model the 1880s. Having said that, I need to hitch Big John to the buggy and head into town.

Keep the faith,
Ray

[richG]

Removed

Rich

[CNE Runner]

Hey Rich. Well,,,when you're wrong, you're wrong. I did miss the link and am sorry about that (really neat car isn't it?). You are right; the instructions for the photography car kit do look fairly easy. Hmmm....'just might try one if it is on the market. Wow...BC Models had over fifty different types of rolling stock??? You really know how to hurt a guy don't you Rich. Let's hope Bittercreek makes even a small portion of BC's offerings.

My wife and I will be traveling throughout the Southwest this summer. I think I will follow Yampa Bob's suggestion of "haunting" any hobby shops encountered along the way. BTW that old Varney kit, I built, was bought at a train show we vendored for $3 (vendor to vendor cost). It still amazes me the difficulty early model railroaders had to endure to enjoy their hobby.

I think I'll fire up #8 (Bachmann American 4-4-0) and tack on that Varney...for old times' sake.

Take care,
Ray

[Yampa Bob]

Dear Ray,
Thanks for the kind comments, I was a bit depressed this morning but you made my day.

I am glad to see older threads such as this one revisited. I sometimes bump some of my threads back to page one just for a fresh exposure.  With all the new members, threads drift to the archives too fast.

I have so many vintage kits I don't know where to start. I found 8 blue box stock cars at another small shop, don't know why I bought them as I don't run stock cars anyway.  Three old Roundhouse Overton kits, Wells Fargo and Baggage, but they are all Santa Fe. Now, these weren't cheap, the dealer had them marked up to $10 each.  I commented about the old price being marked through and he said "Hey these are collector cars".  Yeah right. 

I bought 4 Mantua 1890 style because I liked the blue B&O color and pin striping. I scratched the lettering off 2 of them and did my "Talgo Upgrade" thing, the others still in the box.  I also bought 3 Mantua 1860 for the brown color and flat top roof, but they are lettered Pennsylvania, also still unmodified.

Now that I have several Roundhouse sets of Overtons and Overlands, kinda lost interest in the Mantua and Athearn kits. I'm considering some serious culling out of my cars this summer, you may get some bargains if you're interested. Anyway, my eyes won't take much building anymore.