Eastern Narrow Gauge Time

[ebtnut]

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of a Mason Bogie.  I would think Bachmann could make as either an 0-6-6T (Peach Bottom and others) and as a 2-6-6T (South Park).  I might get one just because they're neat, though I have no use for one on my pike.

[Hamish K]

The only real reason to produce the Peach Bottom loco would be as a spin-off from a South Park 2-6-6t.

The best choice for an EASTERN Mason bogie would be the Boston, Revere Beach and Lynn 2-4-4t's. These were numerous and lastest a long time. The Peach Bottom loco was a solo example and had a short life (2 or 3 years).

The difficulty is that if a Mason Bogie is made that is not a South Park loco the Colorado fanatics will run amok!  I suspect that the B,RB&L locos are too different in general, as well as having a different wheel arrangement,  for much common tooling with a South Park loco to be possible.

Hamish

[ebtnut]

I concur that the model, if done, should follow the South Park prototype.  Doing a version without the pilot wheel and a different stack would serve well enough for the Peach Bottom fans out there.  The Revere Beach locos were a whole other story.  The current Sandy River Forneys are a bit closer, though the driver sizes are considerably different.

[kenruof]

I for one would buy 2 Mason bogies if they were the mid size 2-6-6T DSP&P. I am not modeling Colorado but free lancing in PA, I just like the loco's. Russian iron boiler, red cab, gold trim etc...

Ken

[Dusten Barefoot]

I really dont know what a mason bogy is. I may be a railroad inthusest but I han't got every thang down pat. I am free lancing the Black River & Southern Railroad because I do not have the space for the ET&WNC RR and would like to know how to get some moutians going. My first attempt at a moutian was with brick and a lot of plaster but I for got to add the color before it dried and now I have a snowy mountian in the Eastern part in North Carolina.

[wade]

  Well, I would buy one thats built more to DSP&P specs such as the San Jaun but in Peach Bottom paint. The specs are close enough. I wouldn't expect any more accuracy (in a plastic model) than in the Forneys and that suites me fine. It seems like a great avenue for Bachmann. They could use the same basic frame and make 2-4-4s, 0-6-4s, 0-6-6s and 2-6-6s. If you don't have Aurthur Wallace's book "Mason steam Locomotives" you got to get one. The examples of these engines were used nation wide and then some.         
  For Dusten, Forneys and Mason Bogies appear the same but Mason Bogies I think began production earlier and I know the drivers of Mason Bogies articulated (like a Mallet). I don't think Forneys articulated, but I don't know for sure. Can anyone verify one way or anouther?
  Wade

[Hamish K]

           
  For Dusten, Forneys and Mason Bogies appear the same but Mason Bogies I think began production earlier and I know the drivers of Mason Bogies articulated (like a Mallet). I don't think Forneys articulated, but I don't know for sure. Can anyone verify one way or anouther?
  Wade

That is right, Mason Bogies have articulated drivers, Forneys do not.

I agree that a South Park loco, possibly with a Peach Bottom spin off, is more likely than a Revere Beach loco in the, probably unlikely, event that  Bachmann decide to produce a Mason Bogie. I was just pointing out that the classic EASTERN Mason Bogies were the Revere Beach ones as this is a thread on EASTERN narrow gauge.

Hamish

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[ebtnut]

As near as I can tell, virtually all of the Revere Beach locos were Forneys, not Bogies.  As noted, the difference is that the drivers and frame rotated under the boiler with Bogies, while the Forneys were rigid.  I suspect one of the downfalls of the Mason Bogies (and Mason also built Forneys) was maintaining the flexible steam connections between the boiler and cylinders.  IIRC, there is a Bogie at the big museum (Greenfield's??) near Detroit.

[Hamish K]

As near as I can tell, virtually all of the Revere Beach locos were Forneys, not Bogies. 

Every source I have seen states that the Revere beach locomotives were the Mason Bogie type, not Forneys. Not all were built by Mason, after Mason's closed Revere beach bought the design and had it made by other makers. See www.ironhorse129.com/Prototype/MasonBogie/Mason_Bogie.htm

Hamish

[wade]

 Hamish,
I appologize if it seems that I diverged from the Eastern thread but I am trying to justify to Bachmann the production of a Mason Bogie 0-6-4, 0-6-6 or 2-6-6 in Eastern road names. Additional Eastern roads that would fit this general design aside from the Peach Bottom are the Toledo, Delphos & Burlington (2-6-6s - 6 engines) , Cincinnati & Northern (2-6-6 - 1 engine) and Calumet & Helca Minning (0-6-4s - 2 engines). I believe there were more and of coarse many were boomers. To say that the Boston, Revere Beach & Lynn's are "The classic Eastern Mason Bogie" is only an opinion, just like saying "the only reason for Bachmann to produce the Peach Bottom Mason Bogie would be as a spinnoff of the DSP&P 2-6-6" is only an opinion. After all, Bachmann has produced Ma&Pa locomotives with great sucess (4 soon to be 5 in HO and 1 4-4-0 in G gauge of narrow gauge Baltimore & Leigh#6). The Boston, Revere Beach & Lynn's Mason Bogie 2-4-4s were certainly beautiful. I would buy one. Due to there quantity you could say that they were the most common, but they were used nation wide also. The obvious choices for production in my OPINION are Heislers, 4-4-0s, 4-6-0s and continueing with SR&RL equipment. As long as the economy holds, these narrow gauge avenues will eventually lead to  Mason Bogies I hope.
  Wade

[Hamish K]

Of course my statements are only an opinion, probably the majority of posts on this board are expressing opinions, nothing wrong with that.
Given that the Revere Beach locos  lasted longer, were more numerous and were well know and attractive  I will defend my opinion that they are the classic Eastern Masons.

I had agreed with you that , if Bachmann were to make a Mason, a South Park loco with, where possible, spin-offs for other roads including eastern ones would probably maximise their sales. Doesn't stop me preferring the Revere Beach locos.

Hamish

Hamish way to

[wade]

Hamish,
  I apologize, this time for not realizing that you were only intending to state an opinion. Looking back I now notice that you write in an authoritative style.
Thanks for the great link. The B,RB&L is a curiuos narrow gauge to me by being a commuter line. Do you know of any web sites on the B,RB&L? All the information I have is from Hilton's book "American Narrow Gauge Railroads" and Wallace's book "Mason Steam Locomotives". In particular, what speeds did they run? I read that their curvature was negligible. Is that your understanding as well? And what about grades? In my visits to the Boston area I found it to be hilly right to the water's edge, unlike Maryland where I grew up.
Wade

[Dusten Barefoot]

I would like some scenery tips. I have attemted mountians, but built them out of brick and plaster.( DO NOT DO THAT) I am a newbie if you want to say because I have not really got a model railroad started, my self being 15, and not having a part time job has a lot to do with it; also money is tight now days and only get my supplies around christmas and my birthday. I aquire my stuff frome my dad and I need some scenery tips on mountians, and also rivers, vally's, the works.

[ebtnut]

Hamish: My appologies.  Pulled the trigger before aiming.  Yes, most all of the BRB&L locos were of the Bogie design, though built by 3 different builders.  It isn't readily apparent from the pics, but is definitly noted as such in the chapter on Locos in the book.  Amazingly, one of them lasted (in stationary steam service) till the end of electric service in 1940.  For those unfamiliar, the Boston, Revere Beach and Lynn was a 3-foot gauge pike built along the beaches north of Boston with ferry connections into the Hub City.  The road began with steam in the 1870's, and converted to electricity in 1928.  Bad timing, as the conversion was expensive, and the Depression hit almost immediatly, so the road quit in 1940.

[Dusten Barefoot]

Looks like the topic has almost derailed. What did the BRB&L Railroads locomotives look like?