tyco memorbillia

[Woody Elmore]

The NYC used their new GP-20s in the Manhattan westside yards. I used to bicycle over and watch the engines couple up to the freights that would head upstate.

When Tyco brought out their GP-20, a very accurate model with correct numbers, I went out and bought two. They had a power truck in the cab, a big weight and a dummy second truck. There was no frame. Unfortunately the single power truck they used just didn't work well at low speeds. In addition the traction tires caused all kinds of mayhem at switches.

I have seen many of the GP-20s with new mechanisms - Atlas worked well. The shells were nicely done but you had to fill in the little retangular holes used to mount the Tyco drive.

[Jim Banner]

Thanks, Brad, Woody and others.  I guess I will have to change that from "very rare" to just "rare."  I did not realize there were many of them.  I did this one because it was the only GP-20 I could find at the time.  I believe Life Like now has a GP-20 with sound.  Maybe there were GP-20's by others.  Anyone remember?

[Atlantic Central]

Lets take a balanced look at Mantua/TYCO over their long history. Fact is the "quality" was always pretty good. This company was an early pioneer in this hobby and made some great models, and some not so great ones.

However, on the whole, they where more of a train set company, geared at the ready to run market in latter years and never moved into the market for more advanced modeling. There models where state of the art for the 30's and 40's, and that where most of them stayed.

Even by the the time I entered the hobby in 1968 their level of detail and realisum was not considered by most to be up to the standards of the day.

Yes, the loco kits provided a good starting point for detailing projects, but as desgined/built they where pretty spartan even by 1968 standards.

Several ideas they where very committed to seemed to hold them back from a big following with more advanced modelers. They where VERY slow to accept/adopt RP25 wheels, they where commited to truck mounted couplers for the most part and the "TYCO" business model took them further from the modelers/hobby shops and more toward the toy stores.

They did make great improvements when they revamped the steam locos in the 90's, but it was too little, too late, against the likes of Bachmann Spectrum and Proto 2000.

To this day the only products in their line that interest me are the steam locos as a starting point for detailing and serious kit basing. If I may say so myself, I have a beautiful Atlantic built by super detailing their Atlantic and putting a Bachmann tender behind it.

As to rare, I'm not into that much, but "rare" only establishes value if someone actually wants the thing. There may only be 3 of something on the planet, but if ony one person wants it, its not all that valueable.

Some would cringe at my Atlantic because I took one of those "rare" "limited production" "serial numbered" locos and kit bashed it it. Personally thats all they are good for in my opinion. And the newer ones with the improvements are the best starting points for such projects.

As for their diesels, I never saw anything special about them, but I know they did make decent models of several items not made by anyone else at the time.

I rule out most of their products just because of the truck mounted couplers, but then again I rule out Trix for similar reasons. But both fall into that catagory of quality toy rather than scale model.

Sheldon 

[Jim Banner]

I remember the late 50's - early 60's where a number of companies got into the "I can make it cheaper and almost as good" wars.  The trouble was, after enough steps of "almost as good," they were no good at all, no matter how low the price.

The turning point came when Atlas decided to go the other way.  I think they wanted to see if a better mouse trap really could make people beat a path to their door.  So they brought out a top notch product, made by Kato, marketed by Atlas.  The rest is history.  Atlas/Kato locomotives sold so well that everyone else had to follow suit or disappear.  Bachmann brought out their Spectrum series, Life Like their Proto 2000.  Tyco and others disappeared.

As modellers, we live in a wonderful era.  Bachmann "Standard" diesels are better than just about everything on the market in the bad old days before the Atlas/Kato RS-3.  Steam locomotives also took a giant leap forward when Bachmann brought out their Spectrum 2-8-0.  Wonderful detailing and performance that was rarely seen even in locomotives 10 times the price.  Again, others followed suit.  And steam saw a rebirth that I for one thought would never happen.  A wonderful era indeed.

[SteamGene]

Jim, two comments.
'You make it seem that Atlas appeared sometime in the '60s.  I think it was later. 
For steam, I really think you have to go before the Spectrum 2-8-0 to the IHC 4-8-2 USRA Heavy.   While the model is not quite up to Spectrum standards, it is a good representation of the C&O J-2, it's reliable, and pulls what its prototype did up steeper grades than the prototype conquored.  Granted, IHC lettered it for every road up to the Trans-Siberian Railroad, but then Bachmann did the same fof it's Consolidation.  At least IHC honored C&O, while Bachmann still doesn't have an ICRR lettering on its model of an ICRR Consolidation.  Funny that Bachmann doesn't also have a model of the FEC USRA heavy Mountain, despite the fact that FEC received most of them.
Gene

[Stephen Warrington]

I agree with Gene IHC's heavy mountain was first on the scene I have one painted for the PRR and even tho it is now covered in dust on the display shelf it could out pull any other steamer I owned at the time and did wonders on the head end of my 6 car heavyweight PRR passenger train.

Then came the Spec 2-8-0 which I have one of the first runs in Southern black but still no ICRR for a ICRR locomotive.

Stephen

[Woody Elmore]

There are some rare Mantua items. The original Mantua sharknose, which was die cast, is relatively rare. A friend had one and it was terribly heavy and that negated some pulling power.

Also the Mantua steamers from the late forties and early fifties, the 8-ball mogul, Belle of the Eighties and Reading Goat, are really nice additions to a collection if you can find them.

Tyco  steam engines were reliable - you got your money's worth. When they went into trainsets the engineering and quality went down.

I started in HO with their 0-4-0 tank engine and graduated to an all metal gearbox drive pacific. That was one nice engine.

Unfortunately there are many people who think that every old train, whether Lionel or Tyco, is a rare jewel. A lot of the Tyco stuff was cranked out in huge quantities and quality suffered.

[tonycook1966]

Jim, two comments.
'You make it seem that Atlas appeared sometime in the '60s.  I think it was later. 

I think Atlas' big move into fine quality HO-scale diesels and rolling stock begins in late 1974 with the intro of the Roco-Austria produced group of HO-scale diesels.  The group started in December '74 with the SD24 and followed with an impressive run of new locos through 1975 that included the SD35; GP38 (hi and low nose); GP40; and FP7.

Take a look at my Atlas site for more on these classics...


http://tycotrain.tripod.com/atlashoscaletrainscollectorsresource/



The Roco-made Atlas HO-scale SD-24 in CB&Q

The Atlas Kato-made locos begin arriving later in the '80s.

Tony

[Jim Banner]

You make it seem that Atlas appeared sometime in the '60s.  I think it was later.

Actually, I believe it was shortly after WWII that Atlas appeared, certainly before 1950.

And I think Tonycook is right - the Atlas/Kato locomotives were a product of the 80's, not the 70's.  The Atlas/ROCO that preceded them were good, but not quite as good runners as the Atlas/Kato.

IHC was not a big seller in Canada at the time.  Occasionally some Mehano-Teknica products were sold under their own name.  Dealers may have been turned off by the earlier offerings that were under powered and under weight.  So here it was the Bachmann Consolidation that was the big breakthrough.

Note that Mehano's present day offerings, sold through Superstore, are a vastly improved product.

[Woody Elmore]

I had a set of original Atlas/Roco Alco FA and FB - both powered with huge can motors. I purchased them in the late seventies and a buddy of mine still has them and they run smoothly. The Roco engines had a little gear growl but that made them sound like diesels in the era before DCC.

There is a Tyco GP-20 lettered for NYC up for auction on Ebay - if you'd like to see one in pristine condition, take a look.