Passenger Trains

[WGL]

 I just got the F7B DCC/Sound unit for my Intermountain F7A DCC\Sound Great Northern.  Using the instructions from Bachmann EZ Command Control's DVD, I had no problem re-programming it from Address 3 to the Address 1 for my locomotive.  I have yet to measure whether or not the B unit increases the speed of my passenger train.  Initially, running it & my Spectrum EMD SD-45 freight train slowed the freight, but, after a while, it re-gained some speed.  I still run the 8-car passenger train at full throttle & the 18-car freight at 3/4 throttle to keep them at about equal speed.
  I had to resort again to wiring 4 cars together, because the McHenry 52 couplers I used to replace horn & hook on my IHC cars don't seem to close as securely as some knuckle couplers.
Reading The Great Northern Railway: a History, I learned that the new Empire Builder of 1947 had 12 passenger cars.  I have 8.  Twelve 11" long passenger cars, plus the F7A & B, would make a train about 12' long, occupying almost a third of my 39' layout.  I'd like to hear from anyone on this forum who runs a passenger train on a home layout.  One option would be to use 72' cars, instead of 85' ones.  Online sellers often don't state the length of their passenger cars, however.

[jayl1]

WGL - just a few suggestions.  I'm sure others will chime in later.

Speed - Give the engines some time to break in.  Others will give you various times.  I usually go between 30-45 minutes in each direction.  Then check & oil if necessary with plastic compatible products.  LaBelle makes a fine oil & grease.

Also some engines are geared differently.  The "real" engines were geared for freight (slower) or passenger (faster)  service.

McHenry couplers - Try a Kadee coupler of the same size.  They are more durable - especially if you want to run long trains.

Good luck!
Jay

[Nigel]

Unless you have a booster, you are exceeding the power capabilities of your E-Z Command System with two sound equipped locomotives - never mind about lights in the passenger cars.

Get a booster.  Give the locomotives some break in time, as suggested.  Run in both directions at variable speeds.  They need a very very tiny amount of lubrication.  Make sure you use a proper plastic compatible hobby lubricant.

[WGL]

Jayl1 & Nigel,
Thanks for the advice.  I guess 10 minutes wasn't long enough for breaking in a locomotive.
  Is LaBelle a thicker lubricant than the Wahl clipper oil many have recommended for retarding oxidation on the rails?

[Yampa Bob]

I think the Labelle 108 is a slightly thinner viscosity. (75 SUS @ 100 degrees F.) Labelle also makes #106 grease with teflon. 

[WGL]

  It would be helpful if manufacturers of locomotives included information about maintenance, including lubrication.  Is there a site on the web that shows what parts to lubricate & when to use oil & when grease?  Somewhere, I read that manufacturers often lubricate their locomotives too much.  I haven't found any oil coming off my models onto my fingers, though.

[SteamGene]

I'd stay with eight cars on a 39' layout.  I assume you mean 39 feet of track.  If you have at least one of each type of car on the Empire Builder, you have selectively compressed the train.  In addition, I imagine if they hadn't sold enough tickets the train might be reduced in the number of coaches or sleepers.
Gene

[WGL]

  Yes, I have a 39' layout for the passenger train.  I just got a Sheffield Farms milk tank car, because my grandfather Sheffield had a dairy farm.  The information with it says that milk tank cars were coupled to passenger trains, because passenger trains were faster.  The milk was chilled before loading into these unrefrigerated cars.  However, my Intermountain F7A-B DCC\with sound passenger locomotive is not as fast as my Spectrum EMD SD-45 DCC\without sound freight locomotive.

[Yampa Bob]

Factories like to sell lubricants, but their use is over stated.  I use a tiny bit of Labelle 106 grease with teflon on the worm gear and anywhere there is metal to metal contact, such as the axles on steamers.  For plastic gears I use #108 light oil, applied with a toothpick or 4/0 sable brush.

The factories (and some modelers) tend to over lubricate.

Regarding the locomotives' speeds, as Nigel mentioned you are probably pushing the limit of the EZ Command without a booster.  The available current is about 1 amp usable, although the specs rate it at 1.5 amp for an extra margin.  The current has to be divided among all the locomotives in the consist or running separately.

The SD-45 pulling 8-10 cars is probably drawing about .3 amp.  I have not tested the current draw on a sound loco, but I'm guessing about .6 amp or more in consist.   

For locos in consist, the current isn't proportionally additive.  That is, if a single loco draws .5 amp with 10 cars, 2 locos in consist may only draw a total of .8 amp since the load is shared.

As a real world example, when the 100 unit coal trains come through our ranch, the 6 to 8 locos are almost idling.  All those locos aren't so much for sheer power, but to keep drive motors from overheating, better fuel economy, increased longevity of the engines and of course added traction.

You are probably running all the locos without the controller tripping, but the speeds are greatly reduced.  Essentially your current "bank" is empty with no remaing margin.  Keep in mind it also depends on the rolling resistance of your cars.

The only way to know for sure what your current requirements are, is to run tests with a meter. A handy instrument is the "RRAmpmeter" sold by Tony's, which measures true RMS values.

[WGL]

Yampa Bob,
  Thanks for the advice on lubrication & the estimates.  I wondered when Jim Banner said that the EZ Command is 1.5 amps but the manual says 1 amp.  You explained the discrepancy.  My SD-45 is pulling 18 cars.   The EZ Command 5 amp power booster is so expensive that one could buy a Digitrax Zephyr for less, although it is just 2.5 amps.  I am wondering which would be the better investment.

[Yampa Bob]

Either you're a nightowl like me or an early riser. I started for bed 3 hours ago, but just one more post. 

The EZC power supply is rated at 1 amp but possibly derated.

You might look into the "Zonemaster" series by CVP Products.  I think the dual is around $80, you also need the adjustable power supply.  You can download the spec sheet and instruction manual from their site.

http://www.cvpusa.com/

I recently ran current tests on some Bachmann DCC equipped diesel locos, but only on DC power.  The distributive and cumulative current results might be of interest to you....or not.   

http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,6229.0.html

I'm outa here, catch you later.

[pdlethbridge]

never, never, never use vasoline or 3 in 1 oil. Make sure the oil or grease is plastic compatable.

[WGL]

Yampa Bob,
Yes, I'm a nightowl & suffer from insomnia--except after supper. 
  I tried my Intermountain F7A & B on DC.  They wouldn't even start until I turned the throttle almost to maximum!  At max, their horns sounded but they didn't move.  After they got going, they would run at max & about 3/4 & 2/3 speed.  Running them very slowly seems not possible.
  model-city now has EZ Command 5 amp booster for $130--about half the list price, so I took the plunge.
  pdlethbridge, right, I don't want to have to clean the gears, as someone was advised to do here after using 3in1 oil!

[pdlethbridge]

try your intermountain units one on the track at a time( no other locos or decoders running), see if they run better

[Yampa Bob]

Seems I was being too conservative about the current for sound locos. It would be nice if the factories listed the current requirements in the specs. 

Glad you found a good price on the booster.  Please keep us posted on results.