layout expansion to HO

[graywolf]

Hi folks, I need some help re. making an N scale layout into HO. I found a 1995 MR magazine that has a very interesting Nn3 layout that is 18"x36". I am trying to determine what the ratio would be to convert it to HO. I know you can't double it. The layout is a mining scene which has a 6%max grade. What can climb that or would I have to somehow tame that down? If there is interest I will try to photograph it and post or if anyone has some old MR mags it is in the 1995 Great Model RR special edition. Thanks, Paul

[Len]

You could use a layout planning software, like "AnyRail" to do the track plan in HO, which would give you a rough idea what the size would be.

A 6% grade is really pushing it. But it would be in the upper range of possible on straight track for some prototype Shay geared locomotives pulling up to 200 tons that could make it up 1 in 14 (7%) grades. As curves are added, or got sharper, the amount of slope that could be handled went down. This is due to the increased friction put on the drive wheels by the curves.

If keeping the same track plan, reducing the slope of the grade will increase the length of the layout.

Len

[Terry Toenges]

It would be cool to see a pic of it.

[Len]

There are some pics of Shay's on 1 in 20 (5%) grades, and text references to the 1 in 14 (7%) grades here:
https://railwaywondersoftheworld.com/shay-locomotive.html

There's a link to a pic of a Shay with some logging buggies that is claimed to be on a 12% grade here:
http://www.catskillarchive.com/rrextra/shay.Html

This is the pic:


I have my doubts that's actually a 12% grade, as the max I've ever seen mentioned in prototype grade specifications is 1 in 14 (7%).

Len

[Hunt]

Paul,
Build a temporary length of track where you can vary the grade to determine what your trains can negotiate. 

[graywolf]

photo

     

[graywolf]

the actual layout

   

[graywolf]

more views


             

[graywolf]

last photo   


         

[Hunt]

Multiply N scale dimension by 1.837 to convert to HO scale.

Suggest instead of doing all the multiplications use AnyRail,  Start with the free version.
Click Here AnyRail

[jward]

You said the layout is 18" by 36"

You should be able to build an HO version on a 4x8 with room to spare. Looking over the plan, you'd be able to increase the curves to 18r minimum, which should greatly improve its functionality. You'd probably be able to decrease the grade to around 4% as well.

[Trainman203]

My memory says N = 1/160 and HO = 1/87.5.

If so, 160 / 87.5 = 1.828.  Correct my initial assumption if need be.

[graywolf]

Those numbers work in that conversion, but based on that the 18X36 layout would endup being 33X66 and I know that would not work with HO. You may be able to fit it on a 4X8 but that would be a squeeze. I aim for gentle corner radii not looking for making it work with 18"radius. I would probably draw it out on a decent size piece of paper and then cut the paper into 1/4 pieces and put the pieces in the corners of a drawing that was scaled to the 13X9 foot area I have to build in and then connect the corners with track blending it to look decent.

[Hunt]

My memory says N = 1/160 and HO = 1/87.5.

If so, 160 / 87.5 = 1.828.  Correct my initial assumption if need be.

HO = 1:87.1
Click Here NMRA STANDARDS, S-1.2 Standards for Scale Models

[jward]

So what radius exactly are you looking to use? Keep in mind the way that layout is designed you will need to access it on three sides. Fooling around with the plan in anyrail, you can get the grades down to 3% on a 4x8 with 18r. In your 9x13 space, you'd be able to have a 30" aisle all around the layout, Any larger than that, and you won't be able to squeeze into the places you'll need to go.