Bachmann 2-8-4 Sand Dome Removable?

[J3a-614]

The C&O T1 is one of the finest looking 2-10-4s in my opinion. A shame none were saved.

I just did some checking--and what appears to be a close cousin survives!

This is AT&SF No. 5000, the Madame Queen, a one-off engine from Baldwin built in 1930 (same year as C&O's Limas) that was intended as a prototype for series production, but the Depression intervened. . .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Fe_5000

Driver size, cylinder stroke (bore is one inch larger), and grate area all are the same or close to that of the C&O engine.

She's a good looker, too, though rather different in appearance from the somewhat cleaner Lima design:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/texas/atsf5000-yesteryear.jpg

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/texas/atsf5000-wessel.jpg

http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/740/p/256779/2877263.aspx

There is a group that would like to get her to run again.

How many of us would want to see that?

I would. . .

[Trainman203]

J3a,  that was a great dissertation on evolved vs original superpower steam locomotive design.  I'd never really closely compared MoPac vs NKP Limas, but yes, the MP one is distinctly more "first generation", if we can call it that, superpower design, more akin to earlier drag freight USRA engine design, especially with the lower drivers.  You can tell by looking at it that it wasn't intended to move freight at 60 and 70 mph like the NKP engines.

So maybe the Bachmann Lima isn't so suited to making a dead on MP engine.  However, MP completely rebuilt its USRA light Mountains with taller drivers (and a lot more) in the late 30's.  It could be a what-if MP tall drivered 2-8-4 rebuild.

[Dakota7820]

The Nickel Plate version being sort of a new generation locomotive sort of fits the story for my railroad. I wanted the 2-8-4s to be the last steam locomotives built for the railroad. In my version of history, my system ordered new FT diesels in 1940-41 and was about to order a bunch more, but was limited by the WWII restrictions (just like the Santa Fe's situation). The 2-8-4s were built to help combat the motive power shortage after carefully studying the Nickel Plate's use of the design.

[J3a-614]

J3a,  that was a great dissertation on evolved vs original superpower steam locomotive design.  I'd never really closely compared MoPac vs NKP Limas, but yes, the MP one is distinctly more "first generation", if we can call it that, superpower design, more akin to earlier drag freight USRA engine design, especially with the lower drivers.  You can tell by looking at it that it wasn't intended to move freight at 60 and 70 mph like the NKP engines.

So maybe the Bachmann Lima isn't so suited to making a dead on MP engine.  However, MP completely rebuilt its USRA light Mountains with taller drivers (and a lot more) in the late 30's.  It could be a what-if MP tall drivered 2-8-4 rebuild.

Actually, NKP's first 2-8-4s were built by Alco in 1935; believe it or not, it was  even proposed that they would be streamlined!  Thankfully the NKP's relatively poor financing scotched that deal; they and their many variations looked great as is!

Those 1935 Alcos were indeed a turning point in 2-8-4s.  Prior to their construction, few of the designs used other than the 63-inch driver that had been the standard for fast 2-8-2s; afterwards, very few 2-8-4s were built with 63 inch drivers.

One notable and somewhat mysterious exception were the last 2-8-4s built--Pittsburgh & Lake Erie's A-2a class of 1948.  Besides being the last steam engines from Alco (the plant was already converting to diesel production, and the tenders had to be contracted out to Lima), they were purchased after P&LE had already started dieselization.  They took a lot of design cues from NYC's famous Niagaras of three years earlier, and were delivered in a type of olive green paint.  Reportedly they did not ride well.

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/berkshire/?page=nyc

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/berkshire/NYC-9401Color-A-2-001a.jpg

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/berkshire/NYC-9401Color-A-2-002a.jpg

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/nyc/nyc-s9402.jpg

[J3a-614]

The Nickel Plate version being sort of a new generation locomotive sort of fits the story for my railroad. I wanted the 2-8-4s to be the last steam locomotives built for the railroad. In my version of history, my system ordered new FT diesels in 1940-41 and was about to order a bunch more, but was limited by the WWII restrictions (just like the Santa Fe's situation). The 2-8-4s were built to help combat the motive power shortage after carefully studying the Nickel Plate's use of the design.

What you are describing was essentially the case for the RF&P 2-8-4s, though in that case the problem may have been a lack of room on Baldwin's erecting floor for that road's preferred (and beautiful) 4-8-4s!

http://www.northamericanrails.com/yahoo_site_admin1/assets/images/RF__P_4-8-4_615_-_Copy.130211442_large.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/18/b3/53/18b353cbb4ed73edc123456fb46ec790.jpg

The differences, as ordered by RF&P on its Limas (which, as I recall, were the only engines on the road from that builder) included the standard RF&P pilot, a smaller sand dome, an inside bearing lead truck, and the automatic train control equipment that was standard on RF&P road power--just the sort of thing a freelance modeler would do.

This sort of "story" was also the idea behind the cosmetic changes to C&O 2716 as a "Southern" excursion locomotive, so you're in good company!

[Dakota7820]

Those RF&P 2-8-4s are very nice! Based of the Nickel Plate design, yet had their own look. Maybe these are the examples I should follow for mine. 

Being a Texas line, I'll still be using oil tenders.

[J3a-614]

Just for fun, something completely different. . .

How about a 2-8-4 for a shortline, or at least a secondary carrier?

Let's consider the original Norfolk Southern F-1--five very light (due to bridge restrictions) but modern 2-8-4s (Baldwin, 1940), built to replace or relieve fairly old 2-8-0s:

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/berkshire/?page=ns

Visually, at least to me, they look like a modernized USRA light 2-8-2 with an enlarged firebox and some interesting modern mechanical details, among them Baldwin disc drivers and an exhaust steam injector on the fireman's side as a form of feedwater heater:

http://www.usgennet.org/usa/nc/county/beaufort/sellersrr/3sm.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4094/4920445387_cfd26031d8_b.jpg

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/111480.aspx

[J3a-614]

Just a little more fun. . .

NKP (former W&LE) 2-8-4, in color; forgot to note that this series had footboard pilots:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/2e/0c/28/2e0c28357eecca4fde11fbf5c4bbb1fd.jpg

http://www.steamlocomotive.com/berkshire/wle6412.jpg

Close cousin L&N M-1 2-8-4--interpretation of Super Power by Baldwin:

http://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/fileSendAction/fcType/0/fcOid/38596413069948343/filePointer/38596413132687967/fodoid/38596413132687963/imageType/LARGE/inlineImage/true/2-8-4%20L%26N%201982.jpg

http://www.railpictures.net/photo/427374/

[J3a-614]

http://www.railarchive.net/randomsteam/ln1967-1970.htm

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/e8/3b/57/e83b576739440cb81f761e3cc6d036fe.jpg

[Dakota7820]

I saw a picture of one of those Norfolk Southern Berkshires a long time ago and at first thought it was a photoshop or something. A very cool locomotive. I bet it was a "Cadillac" for a smaller road. 

As for the L&N 2-8-4s.....that's a beautiful locomotive. As good looking as the NKP's in my opinion. To my eyes, the cab looks similar to Santa Fe's Baldwin 4-8-4s. Wasn't one of these preserved?

[Trainman203]

Not many really big engines were saved.  My guess is that it was too difficult  to get them out to the park.

[RayS]

The Bachmann Baldwin modern 4-4-0 comes with details to backdate this engine.  I cannot figure how to disassemble the engine to install these
backdated items without damaging it. I took out the screws on the bottom of the engine and it still does't come apart. I called factory and got no help. Can you help me? 

[Trainman203]

Those old fashioned domes they furnish as extra parts aren't really corrrct for the modern 4-4-0.