Couplers that do not match.

[Trainman203]

Bill, I'd say figure out which couplers are the consistent trouble makers. It won't be all of them, just two or three I bet.  I was going to suggest a coupler height gauge until I realized you have the horn hooks still.  Horn hooks arent that great as you can tell by consensus but I used them a long time and once you get them lined up, for Christmas type layouts they are fine.

Trial and error will tell you which ones are funky.  If they are lining up a little low or high you might be able to very gently (very) bend it in line.  A little heat on the coupler may help it along.

If you are of the mind to convert to knuckle couplers you'd get better performance.  It may be beyond your desire to do so.  I know, I hate car maintenance too.  I converted to knuckle couplers a few cars at a time over lunch hours when I basically had 45 minutes every day with nothing to do.  Built some structures then too.  left more  time in the evening to operate and do fun stuff.

As far as quality control goes, model railroad manufacturing is no different than any other, there will be good and bad days and you might have ended up with a couple of slugs.  I've had them and fixed them.  Maintenance , although not a lot of fun, appears to be a requisite component of model railroading. I've spent entire evenings soldering jumper wires around dead spots instead of operating like I'd much rather do.  It's just something we live with.

Those are nice layouts Bill.

Don't forget the immortal words of Linn Westcott, "model railroading is fun!"

[ACY]

Saved1 you have inadvertently caused confusion by posting your photos in this thread. Bill has yet to post any photos thus far and the type of coupler remains to be seen.

[Trainman203]

Bill i thought of something else.  The problem couplers may be  loose in their mountings and wobbling vertically.  Something may need tightening up.  Or, some very thin plastic shims inside the coupler boxes may get the alignment better.

You can fix this, I assure you.  And get back to operating where the fun is.

[jbrock27]

ACY, S1 did not create any confusion and did nothing wrong in posting his photos.  A lack of paying attention has.  I don't believe Jeff looked at S1's photos before he started his reply, but I don't know for sure bc he, as usual for him, is not  identifying whom he is talking to.  I don't know about TM, but sometimes he gets confused.  Would not be the first time in the last few days.  This is one reason why I address people by name when I respond to them.  Helps avoid "confusion".
Except for concentrating on complaining, ole Bill has not gone into or given much detail.

[Trainman203]

Cmon Brock give us a break  and let's help this guy solve his problem instead of pickin at everyone.

He's got couplers that don't line up and maybe shift around.  If they are train set type couplers they are probably some sort of Delrin plastic, whether horn hook or knuckle.  They can probably be slightly bent in line, tightened up, or shimmed to where his train doesn't aggravatingly part.  I've successfully done that kind of low end fix-it on my train set type stuff before I passed it on.

[jward]

jb
I read the entire post before replying to the original poster, who is dealing with new Amtrak equipment that almost certainly has knuckle couplers. it has been my experience that of the many flaws of the horn hook couplers, mismatched coupler height is almost never a problem.

[jbrock27]

Ok boyz, take it easy.

...let's help this guy solve his problem instead of pickin at everyone.-TM, please see that I was the first one to try to do just that. Please see the response I got for my effort.  And I am not "picking" on anyone, just tried to give an explanation for what ACY perceived as "confusion".   

Ok Jeff.  I see you have covered bases for both Wild Bill and Saving Private Ryan.

Agree with TM, once a knuckle coupler is bent, very hard to make it usable.  If I am not mistaken, Jeff, I believe you have said that at least one time yourself.  Better off chucking it and replacing it.  Concerning HH couplers, I am all in favor of chucking them period, bent or not.

[Bill1462]

As a show of ignorance, I have to pose the question: what is a horn hook coupler and what is a knuckle coupler and what's the difference? Is the horn couple the fixed hook that is harder to connect?

At the train shows I've noticed a dizzying array of couplers, and frankly it is a turn-off. Why are all of those difference couplers necessary? I think that Bachmann's concept of one standard coupler is a grand idea.

Another thing that drives me nuts are those little wires they put under the couplers that simulate the lines that connect cars. Some of them are so long that they catch in the rails. I gladly snip them off to a reasonable length. And yes I know that sometimes they sag because they are lose and I tighten them. Still, some couplers just will not match up no matter what I do.

When it comes to realism, couplers are the last thing on my mind. I'd much rather spend time weathering buildings, building scenery and even building cars from kits than messing with 100 different types of couplers. When people see your layout, they are more impressed the scenery and the trains. Couplers should be like a umpire at baseball game. You only seen him when he's NOT doing his job well. The same thing applies to couplers so far as I'm concerned.

[jward]

horn hook couplers were standard equipment on ho trains until about 15 years ago. somebody earlier in this thread posted a photo of them. horn hooks were notoriously unreliable, and would often derail your train when you tried to back up. they were, however, in the public domain and so most manufacturers included them on their rolling stock. in the meantime, kadee had a metal knuckle type coupler, which looked and operated like the real ones. it was also a durable, reliable performer, and most serious model railroaders switched, at considerable expense to kadee couplers. kadees were originally patented, and once the patents expired others started to make similar couplers, usually plastic but all compatible with kadees. soon, the manufacturers phased out the horn hooks as standard equipment in favour of the knuckle type. your Amtrak cars have knuckle type couplers.

the metal piece you trim off is the trip pin. it allows the couplers to uncouple automatically through the use of an uncoupling magnet. out of the box, these trip pins are sometimes too low, as you have found. when they are too low, they snap on thing like rerailers, switches and even track nails. with a metal coupler like the kadees this doesn't usually cause damage, but plastic couplers will bend down, and once the coupler is bent it is very hard to straighten it out to what it was originally. when this happens, I usually just replace the coupler with a metal (kadee) one.

the wide variety of couplers on the market are due to the wide variety of rolling stock available. especially on older equipment, there is no default standard to which everybody conforms. if you are not worried about uncoupling your trains, you could replace the couplers with a homemade metal drawbar between cars. a long this piece of brass with a hole in each end, that can be screwed into your coupler pockets in place of the couplers.

[jbrock27]

I would rather be watching the NY GIANTS game but against my better judgement, will take the time to post again here.

Wild Bill, no reason to feel ignorance, but I would have thought what Horn Hook couplers are, would have been as crystal clear as the pics posted by S1 and the subsequent postings about them. 

If the the trips pins bother you so much on knuckle couplers , keep snipping them, many do, but I suggest you do so before putting the coupler on the car.  If you are snipping them when they are on the car, what may be happening is you may be twisting and deforming other things, causing the looseness you are complaining of.  Except for a screw that holds a coupler box in place, there really is nothing to loosen or tighten.  If the screw is too tight, it keeps the coupler from moving side to side.  Adjustments have to come from other things,which is where we started this in the first place.  There are several ways to accomplish this.   

Just as you prefer realism for cars, buildings etc, many prefer realism in the size of the knuckle couplers.  I am not one of them, #5 and #148 size Kadees and EZ Mate Mark IIs work for me and my son.  But, this is why there are many to choose from, in addition to having differing designs to accomplish the correct height.  I would not term the choices as "dizzying", it is not like they are unlimited choices.  This is not rocket science we are talking about here.   Frankly, I am surprised after seeing you list the number of items you wish to focus on for realism and that couplers are not among them.
If you do not have a Kadee coupler gauge, I would suggest getting one, as was mentioned previously.  I always recommend the plastic version.

[Trainman203]

Bill I am watching the Saints game AND running my layout AND posting, a miracle of multi tasking at my advanced age.

Go back and read some of the stuff I said earlier.  I dont think it matters what kind of couplers you have, I bet they are plastic and a little bending will fix them.  If not a little shimming or tightening oughta do it.  All of this is part of model railroading, always had been.

I've got a great idea.  Figure out by trial and error which the bad cars are.  Take the bad cars off the layout for now and run the good ones.  One by one, figure out what each car needs by the low end techniques we talked about earlier.  I, like you, highly dislike fooling with maintenance when operation  could be going on.

Don't fool with those cars now, go back and have some fun with those great layouts you had pictures of put up.

Your friend, the trainman

[jbrock27]

I, like you, highly dislike fooling with maintenance...

Don't know anyone who would admit to loving it.  A chore, but time taken to do it properly, just like time taken for proper track work, pays the dividend in the end.  Once done, it is more than likely, done.

Good luck to the AINTS !  I bet if they played the GIANTS tomorrow, they would kick the snot out of the GINTS

[Bill1462]

As might be expected the couplers on the "carpet track" pose more problems than they do on my main layout. The reasons are that "carpet track" requires a run out period to get rid of all the bugs between the track sections, and even after that is done it still moves slightly when the equipment rolls over it. That will result in uncoupling.

My main layout is Atlas track tacked to Woodland Scenics track bed with ballast glued around the edges. That is very solid, but there are still cars that won't stay coupled on it. Most of the time car in back of the first one has coupler lift when it is pulled. I have tightened the screws as tight as they can go. The only solution would be something in the coupler casing to make it stay straight, but good luck on finding something that works for that at the local hobby store.

The worst "carpet track" problem I have left is the connection between the GG-1 engine and the first passenger car. Though trial and error I have able to line up the passenger cars in a certain sequence, with numbers on them to keep them in order, so that they stay together. The problem between the GG-1 and the first passenger car makes that combination a non starter so the passenger train is pulled by the "A and B" freight units. So much for realism.

You guys talk about gaskets and height gages, but the people at the average hobby store don't carry that stuff, and most of them have no idea what it is. When your bread and butter is motorized cars and airplanes and model trains are only a sideline that's the way it is. Like I said the only store in the area is 60 miles away. It's run by some fine people, but getting there is a half day's project given the traffic, which has been getting worse and worse in the Tampa area.

[jbrock27]

Wild Bill, I don't disagree with what you say about the hobby shop, as I have experienced the same thing with my locol one.  So why then, restrict yourself by relying on getting your items and info from there?
What screws are you referring to tightening as much as possible?
And not gaskets, but washers and shims.

[Bill1462]

"So why then, restrict yourself by relying on getting your items and info from there?"

As I said before getting to the train store from where I live is close to all day project. The main contacts I have had with them was to work on a group of vintage Bachmann Pennsylvania Railroad passenger cars that I bought off of eBay. I'd been looking for these cars for years, and finally found them there. They needed work in the interior lighting and other stuff, which I can't do. I have no mechanical ability what so ever. I can write articles for (other) hobby magazines that get published, and I can build kits. But it when it comes to taking something apart, like those cars to work on them, all I'd just tear them up.

I know Bachmann issued some new Pennsylvania cars this years, but this group included stuff like the observation and baggage combine cars, which not in the new Bachmann line-up.

I might add that this hobby seems to be in trouble. The people who run the train store are older and past the usual retirement age. Recently my brother-in-law sold a very large number of O gage engines and other equipment from the estate of a recently deceased uncle by marriage. The deceased train collector thought that he had $100,000 collection, which he had at one time considered leaving to a major operation like the Baltimore Railroad Museum. The collection filled a POD. My bother-in-law got $15,000 for it, and the company that bought it said that they doubted they would be in business five years from now because market is so weak. I have noticed this in other hobbies as well. The young people just don't seem to collect things any more.