15" curves

[Sabadu]

I have a small setup and was wondering if I could get some more track in play if I used 15 inch curves is a few spots.

I would appreciate any opinions on this.  I am running a 2-8-0 engine (from the Dynamis set).

Thanks

[jonathan]

Sabadu.

The 15" radius question comes up a lot around here.

4 of my 6 2-8-0's  will negotiate a 15" radius curve.  Two will not.  That being said, I do not tend to run these locomotive through such a tight curve. 

The one 15" radius turnaround on my layout sees USRA 0-6-0 switchers and ore cars. The small equipment can run through those curves with ease. 

Regards,

Jonathan

[jward]

I would strongly advise against the 15r curves. they are a source of trouble because they are so sharp. and as jonathan has noted, it can be hit or miss whether a given type of loco or car will successfully negotiate them.

[ebtnut]

Just echoing the comments already made - 15" curves are very tight for HO.  You will be limited to small steamers, mainly four or six-coupled switchers.  For diesels, you are generally limited to four-axle power.  Most first generation diesel models (SW's, F's, RS's, etc.) can handle such tight curves.  You also want to limit yourself to freight cars of 40 feet long or less.  Most scale 80' long passenger cars won't pass these curves at all, and probably not some of the 60 footers either. 

[Doneldon]

Sabadu-

I think you're seeing a pattern here as yet another person chimes in with a warning to avoid 15" curves except for very specific purposes, one of which is NOT getting more track on the train board. You'll have more trouble than it's worth if you add the 15" radius curves. Probably the worst is that your railroading will become frustrating (nobody likes derailments) and you'll enjoy yourself less and less. Soon, your layout will be something you spent a lot of money on that you don't use any more.
                                                                                                                                                                                             -- D

[Sabadu]

Thanks for your replies.

I am officially scrapping the 15" curve idea.  I definitely plan on adding a diesel at some point and don't want such limitations.

Thanks again.

[Maletrain]

I'm new here and have a question.  Since this thread is under "General Discussion" rather than "HO", how did everybody know he was talking about HO scale?  Is there something in his profile that I should look at, or did everybody just assume that it must be HO because 15" wouldn't be a problemm for a 2-8-0 in N-Scale and there is no question that it would not work in S-Scale?  Shouldn't this thread have been in the "HO" secton?  When I was opening this thread, I was thinking "Heck, I run my 2-8-0 on 13.75" radius curves with no trouble IN N-SCALE.

[richg]

I'm new here and have a question.  Since this thread is under "General Discussion" rather than "HO", how did everybody know he was talking about HO scale?  Is there something in his profile that I should look at, or did everybody just assume that it must be HO because 15" wouldn't be a problemm for a 2-8-0 in N-Scale and there is no question that it would not work in S-Scale?  Shouldn't this thread have been in the "HO" secton?  When I was opening this thread, I was thinking "Heck, I run my 2-8-0 on 13.75" radius curves with no trouble IN N-SCALE.

That is nothing new here. Some never take to to look through all the forums or Bachmann links.
If it's really obvious, The Bach-Man or another Administrator will move the message to the proper forum.

if you notice something. as soon as you log in, the first forum you see is the General forum. Some never look any further and it never occurs to them to look any further.

Rich

[jward]

simple logic is how we knew that the op was referring to ho scale. he stated he wanted to use 15r to put more track into play, i.e. expand the layout without expanding the overall size. therefore it follows that he would be referring to the sharpest available curve in his scale. in ho that is 15r, in n scale it is 9.75r or 10r depending on whose track you use. in n scale, 15r is a generous curve, able to handle just about any equipment you'd care to run.  s scale was also mentioned, but Bachmann doesn't make s scale, and an s scaler would have no reason to post here. the next larger size, o scale, usually measures curves by diameter not radius.

[K487]

As friendly info:

From all of this sound advice by many men with a lot of experience, I'm going to point out a rare exception.  Might be helpful to some in the future.

I have on my HO layout 3 loops and a figure 8 (all in an L shape).  The figure 8 track carries one ore train: an A----s RS32 pulling 32 old AHM ore cars* and a caboose. 

Now Please Note:  The track radius on each of the figure 8 curves is 11" (yes, that is correct - eleven inches radius.)  The diameter of both curves is exactly 22" track-center to track-center. 

So, how much did I have to alter/adapt/whittle on the RS32?  None what so ever; the engine took those curves right out of the box (surprised me; tested other locos and they all failed). 

Does the engine slip down when pulling the train around those curves?  No, not at all.

Okay, does it look kinda funky?  Believe it or not it does not (at least to me), probably because of the short loco and the shorty ore cars, and you can't see the whole train at any point on the layout.  I enjoy seeing ore car after ore car come out of one tunnel and go into another.  It IS functionally a 32-car unit train (plus caboose).  And I run the train very slowly.

How does the track look and function at 11" radius with easements?  Smooth as silk.  It's all Atlas NS Code 100 flex, and soldered just about perfectly (if I do say so myself - over the past 20 years I figure I've soldered at least 200 rail joints and only had one on a curve come loose; that's a lot of experience.)

* The ore cars are "loaded" but the loads weigh almost nothing.  About two decades ago I took some 3/8" or 1/2" florist styrofoam (from Hobby Lobby), cut oblong pieces to fit in the cars, used a knife blade at a 90 degree angle to the foam and scraped out a gentle hump, applied Elmers yellow glue thinly, turned the piece upside down and pushed it into a pile of scale ore (light reddish HO ballast), let it dry some, trimmed off the excess glue/ore around the the four edges, and put them in my railcars.  I have loaded cars that pull easy (no weight) and can be made empties REAL easy, AND if I have a derailment and a car tips over I don't get get a big mess on the layout.

K487

[MarkInLA]

Yes, Sabadu should have stated the scale he's in. But, still, all anyone had to say was : If you're in HO then the minimum radius , except for switchers working very slow industrial track jobs, is 18 inches (smallest main line curves such as are on some branch lines ) No-go for say, Amtrak passenger train modeling. ....If in N scale smallest radius will be 12" for same given situations, that other than small switchers and freight cars, is a no-go for passenger trains and large locos. For same reason, yards and spurs are treated the same way.     

[charon]

Okay, here comes the monkey wrench. My layout is G gauge and I have 15" radius curves. I am, however, limited to 8 wheel diesels and freight cars all with truck mounted couplers.
Chuck

[jward]

i think you said it all right there. truck mounted couplers in a larger scale. lionel used o27 and 031 curves which were 13.5r and 15.5r respectively. did it work? yes, sorta kinda. could you reliably back trains around those curves? highly doubtful. did it look atrocious? absolutely.

the biggest difference here is that the smaller scales, such as ho and n, are trying to be as close to scale as reasonably possible. with the larger scales, they tend to take liberties with things like trucks and couplers, in order to get their trains around a usable curve. in g scale, after all, the equivalent of a 15r curve would be around 60r. not too many people can, or want to, fit a curve like that in their train room.

[K487]

Jeffery, you got my vote:

"i think you said it all right there. truck mounted couplers in a larger scale. lionel used o27 and 031 curves which were 13.5r and 15.5r respectively. did it work? yes, sorta kinda. could you reliably back trains around those curves? highly doubtful. did it look atrocious? absolutely."

K487

[Joe Satnik]

Dear All,

We have to be careful, here, when talking about Lionel track diameter and radius.  

The 27" and 31" diameters are actually measured to the outside of the track, meaning (at least) to the outside of the ties.

The AnyRail.com track CAD program shows centerline (= to the middle rail)

diameters of 24.87"D  for O-27 and 28.37"D for O-31.

Divided by 2 for centerline radius gives 12.43"R for O-27 and 14.18"R for O-31.

They are not exactly half due to rounding.  

In fractional inches, the numbers are close to 24-7/8"D, 28-3/8"D, 12-7/16"R and 14-3/16"R.

Hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik