Niagara

[tlnibert]

Can the smoke deflectors be removed from Bachmann's Niagara?
Local shop has one, with the EARS.....
Tom

[uscgtanker]

You could cut them off but I don't know if there will be a hole. If there is fill it with clear glue. If not trim to flush. With adding the ears I would like to see what you have. The Niagera is one of my favorite steam locos.

[Doneldon]

Bert-

The smoke lifters are glued on, not cast. You can remove them the same as any other
plastic part. You will probably have to do a little cosmetic work but you shouldn't end
up with any major appearance problems. Even weathering should be able to conceal
your work. Good luck!
                                       -- D

[tlnibert]

Thanks guys
Tom

[Stephen D. Richards]

You will also have to modify the front a bit.  Taking the ears off leaves a long section in the walkway to fill and you will need to make handrails for the steps.  Check Bachmann's Overland.  It is essentially a Niagara without the ears.  That is where I obtaine my patterens for the change over.  Hope that helps a bit,  Stephen

[Chaparral66]

I am new to this message board so please excuse me if I am asking this is in the wrong place.

I just purchased a new DCC-OnBoard Bachmann Niagara 4-8-4.  I have two questions some of you might be able to help me with.

1. It runs OK in DC mode except that the tender derails easily when my imperfect but generally 22 inch radius mainline turns tighten up slightly.  The rear wheels on the tender -- all 5 or 6 of them which are attached to the body of the tender and not on any kind of swiveling truck -- pop off of the track on slightly tighter portions of curves.  Occasionally, too, the locomotive's trailing wheel may come off.  I have reduced the derailment problem somewhat by not using the drawbar between the locomotive and tender, and just attaching the tender with the wires that run from the tender to the rear of the locomotive.  But this loose attachment may eventually cause a break in the wires and probably means I should not pull any cars with the locomotive so as not to stress the wires.  And even this arrangement does not work entirely -- the tender still derails at three spots on my layout.  What to do?  (1) I can try to rework my track somewhat but due to the layout this is very difficult and not much of an option.  I know I can't change switches and curves in my yard.  (2) Maybe I could add weight? -- though I am not sure how I would do that.  Or (3) Maybe Bachmann has recognized this problem and sells an alternate tender for the Niagara which has two (non-prototypical but functional) swiveling trucks or at least a shorter wheel base for the fixed wheels on the back of the tender so they don't pop off on slightly sharper portions of curves?  I doubt I am the only one who has encountered this problem.  It seems like a design flaw of the locomotive/tender.  Incidentally my Bachmann DCC/DC J Class locomotive flies around my layout without a hitch as does my Broadway Limited 4-4-4-4 T1.  The latter has a long fixed wheel base for the 8 duplex drivers but the tender is conventional and as a result the whole thing stays on the track fine and runs without any problems.

2. The Niagara came with two little wire plugs but no instructions on what to do with them.  I have a DC layout.  Does that mean I am I suppose to install these plugs?  If so, where?

Thanks for any help anyone -- including the Bach Man -- can provide me!  Note: Otherwise the Niagara appears to be a great locomotive.  I would like to be able to run it problem-free.

[Doneldon]

Chap-

Do not pull your tender with just the connecting wires. You will undoubtedly pull the wires out of their plugs sooner or later. You don't need that hassle.

The little metal plugs are jumpers which you use if you remove the DCC decoder to run your trains on plain DC. The decoders which Bachmann uses are dual mode which means they automatically detect the kind of power and operate correctly. However, some people feel they get better performance if they remove the decoder and install the jumpers. I suggest that you try it both ways and see which you prefer.

I would try adding a bit of weight to your tender. The fact that your other locos "fly" around your layout (which is almost certainly not prototypical operation) suggests the problem lies with your loco. On the other hand, if the derailments occur at the same three places on your layout suggests to me that your track is not flawless. Rather, it makes me wonder if both your trackage and the tender are out of spec just enough that they play together to cause the derailment.
                                                                                                                                                                                       -- D

[Chaparral66]

Thank you for your reply and advice concerning my Bachmann 4-8-4 Niagara.  I think I will have the plugs installed to disconnect the DCC option.  I now recall that I did that with my Bachmann Spectrum J Class and it may have run a little faster afterwards (though I am not sure about that).  In any event, the J is a good runner on a DC layout.

When I said the J "flew around" my layout I meant that it could run at full speed (maybe 80 mph scale) across the whole layout and never derail.  I realize that that is not prototypical but I mentioned it only to say that while my track work is imperfect, it is pretty good and not so bad that another Bachmann 4-8-4 locomotive couldn't handled it easily.  I do think that the Niagara's tender is problematic from a design point of view.  It may look realistic with the 5 centipede fixed wheels at the back but it is not practical to run.  While my sharpest mainline turns are 22 radius (with a few pinch points where it may be less for a small arc of the turn), I also have grade changes with transitions on curves which all my other locomotives are OK with but I think they too are playing havoc with the Niagara because of the 5 fixed wheels on the tender.  Anyway, I think I will add some weight to the tender as recommended and tinker with the track.  I just don't want to tear large portions of it up to accommodate this locomotive.  I would have liked to see a different tender design.  Thanks!

[ryeguyisme]

Well the J  prototypically speaking can go 100+ MPH in real life, so doing 80 isn't something unheard of, however it will look silly doing that on anything less than 30 inch radius

[Doneldon]

Well the J  prototypically speaking can go 100+ MPH in real life, so doing 80 isn't something unheard of, however it will look silly doing that on anything less than 30 inch radius

... and on anything smaller than a layout that covers a half acre.

[ALCO1000]

Can the smoke deflectors be removed from Bachmann's Niagara?
Local shop has one, with the EARS.....
Tom

Model railroading 101 cut them off  carefully , lightly sand if necessary,usually, 320 grit ,mask off area you do not want to scuff up ,sometimes you can make a sanding stick with some of that sandpaper tacked to the end of a tooth pic,fill hole if necessary using your favorite filler, automotive spot putty the red stuff when dry hit the back side with super glue seems to harden the putty gives it strength and stops the shrink,spot touch up
and your please with your work hopefully,if not touch up again ,make sure your sanding feather edges will give you a primo job,HOPE THIS HELPS!
JACK

[srevac]

Thank you for your reply and advice concerning my Bachmann 4-8-4 Niagara.  I think I will have the plugs installed to disconnect the DCC option.  I now recall that I did that with my Bachmann Spectrum J Class and it may have run a little faster afterwards (though I am not sure about that).  In any event, the J is a good runner on a DC layout.

When I said the J "flew around" my layout I meant that it could run at full speed (maybe 80 mph scale) across the whole layout and never derail.  I realize that that is not prototypical but I mentioned it only to say that while my track work is imperfect, it is pretty good and not so bad that another Bachmann 4-8-4 locomotive couldn't handled it easily.  I do think that the Niagara's tender is problematic from a design point of view.  It may look realistic with the 5 centipede fixed wheels at the back but it is not practical to run.  While my sharpest mainline turns are 22 radius (with a few pinch points where it may be less for a small arc of the turn), I also have grade changes with transitions on curves which all my other locomotives are OK with but I think they too are playing havoc with the Niagara because of the 5 fixed wheels on the tender.  Anyway, I think I will add some weight to the tender as recommended and tinker with the track.  I just don't want to tear large portions of it up to accommodate this locomotive.  I would have liked to see a different tender design.  Thanks! 

I too have the same problem with the engine derailing the tender  I think the design of the coupler is poor as it pushes the tender off of the track.  Also the wires can cause a derailment.  I pushed them back a bit into the tender and this helped a little.  I am now adding weights to the tender a few grams at a time to see if this helps.   

[Doneldon]

I too have the same problem with the engine derailing the tender  I think the design of the coupler is poor as it pushes the tender off of the track.  Also the wires can cause a derailment.  I pushed them back a bit into the tender and this helped a little.  I am now adding weights to the tender a few grams at a time to see if this helps.   

srevac-

The coupling between the tender and loco isn't exactly the problem. There are actually two things which might be causing your problem.

First, the tenders are a bit light in weight over the front truck which allows them to lift a bit, especially if you also have problem two which I'm sure is the case judging by your post. Anyway, open your tender and add an ounce or so in the front of the tender, as low as possible. Pennies are the cheapest way to go if you don't have any lead laying around or some heavy surplus hardware in your screws and nails jar.

The second issue is really worse than the weight, in my opinion, because it can easily go unnoticed. It's the way the wires between the tender and loco are configures. Most come from the factory with the bend and extra wire to allow flexing bent in the horizontal plane, thus exerting lateral force on the tender, particularly when backing through curves or turnouts, and possibly pushing a too-light front off of the rails. The solution is to pull out more wire (gently, don't yank because those wires are tiny little devils) and make vertical loops so it's more like the wire rotates or twists rather than bends. This, plus a little added weight seems to resolve most of the problems you posted about.

Good luck. Let us know if this helped.
                                                              -- D

[rogertra]

I don't own a Niagara so I can't comment directly on that model but Bachmann has at least two routes for the wires between engine and tender.

One has the tender plugs parallel to the rails so the wires go almost straight between engine and tender.

The other has the plugs facing down towards the track.

The best, in my opinion, is the first connection, the one with the plugs parallel to the tracks as these put very little lifting pressure on the tender and are easier to adjust.

The ones where the plugs face down towards the track, by their very design will put an upward pressure on the front of the tender due to the way the wires have to form a "U" shape to reach the engine.  The downward facing plugs are, in my opinion, a poor design.

I'm not sure what one the Niagara has but either way, I always do what Doneldon does and add weight right at the front of the tender and this, along with messing around with the routing of the wires, fixes the tender derailment problem.

Why Bachmann has two version of the plugs and why they don't have one standard design of circuit board to fit in all tenders is beyond me.  But then keep in mind the people who design these models are more than likely not modellers themselves and are thinking "toy train market" rather than "model railroad market".

[electrical whiz kid]

The "hard way", but if done correctly, would be to remove the plug connections and just simply solder the wires.  This I do not recommend if the engine is to be handled a lot.  Also, 22" radiuis is a dite small for s rigid-frame engine that large, and doing that turn at any speed is inviting a derailment.  On my layout, I have gone mostly to smaller framed locomotives for my operations.  To be sure, it is nice to watch a 2-10-4 on stud of a long merchandiser; most vets here will heartily agree; but even on my newest disaster-in-the-making, I will have 30" minimum on the radii; too much of a hassle before.

Rich C.