IHC Covered Hoppers

[Catt]

I have a rather large collection of old Bachmann-LifeLike-AHM/IHC-TYCO cars and have discovered that the price of a truck tuner is more than offset by the better rolling action of the cars.They will eventually all get metal wheels ,but for right now I am happy with the stock plastic wheels.

[CNE Runner]

I adhere to the KISS principle as much as possible; but I'm not convinced Len's idea of using white glue and BBs will work for the long run. BBs and pennies are roughly the same price - that that part seems plausible. I'm am most concerned with the use of 'white glue' [PVC]. 'White glue' does not readily adhere to styrene. Unless one completely fills the tank with a mixture of BBs and 'white glue', one ends up with the glue/BB mixture (which hereafter I will call a 'plug') - hardened on the bottom of the tank. Should the car be turned upside down (or dropped...and don't tell me you have never dropped a car), the resulting 'plug' will rattle around. Having said that, a possible fix is to make sure the tank is filled with glue/BBs to a little over half ('same number of BBs...but more 'white glue'). The tank cylinder arc begins to get smaller and the 'plug' would have nowhere to go.

This is a good idea though and one I will try in the future.

Ray

[jward]

GG1, I agree with K.I.S.S.  Makes life a whole lot easier.

Jeff, thank you for the pic.  What brand are the silver wheels pictured on the tanker?   Metal too, I imagine?

I am not sure what make the wheels are. probably Bachmann or intermountain. some of my older cars have nwsl, which I consider the Cadillac of wheelsets, but they're pricey. they are most definitely not kadee, as I've had trouble with warped axles on kadee wheelsets and don't buy them anymore.

btw, we had a linotype machine in tech school when I went in the early 1980s, and a print shop I worked in a couple of years later used a similar Ludlow machine to cast type slugs. the difference between the two is that a linotype used a keyboard to set the letter molds, whereas on a Ludlow you did this by hand. linotypes were used extensively in newspaper and book publishers, but as I recall their speed was offset by the limited sizes of type. ludlows didn't have that restriction, and we could set headlines up to 72 points with them. both were made unnecessary by the rise of offset printing in which plates were burned from any type or image. type slugs were restricted to the older letterpress type presses, which basically stamped the type slugs against the paper, instead of the roller action of the offset press.

letterpresses were good for certain operations which offset presses either couldn't do, or did poorly, such as numbering, perforation, or decals.

[Woody Elmore]

I used to get my linotype slugs from a member of our club. I would think that modern typesetting is all done via computer. I'm sure that there are places in the world still doing printing the old way.

I used to put pieces of linotype inside box cars right over the trucks. The cars really tracked well but it was a workout for the engines!

I think the BB approach is probably the easiest and best (short of modeling a railroad that nver handles tank cars!)

[Catt]

I've used white glue and fishing weights for years to ballast HO and On30 rolling stock.I've also used it in N scale cars.Eleene's tacky glue also works very well

[jbrock27]

Thanks Ray, Jeff, Woody and Catt.
Sorry to repeat my question to you Ray, but since you don't have a lot of faith in the white glue idea, what kind/brand of epoxy do you recommend?

Jeff, funny what you said about the Kadees-I just took delivery on a set 12 .  Would Kadee not honor you going to them and telling them the axles were warped, or did this warping occur over time/use?
If they were formed that way, is it easy enough for one to see a warped axle or is there a recommended test to determine that.

Catt, alot of our freight rolling stock is made up from cars from many of the makers you cited, in addition to a good number of Athearn Blue Box freight.  We don't have set rules for wheels or wheelsets.  If they roll/run fine, they stay the way they are.  Of course, we have found backing up is much easier with car mounted couplers than the talgos.  I also really like the Bachmann Silver series freight cars! 

[CNE Runner]

It isn't that I haven't much faith in PVC (white glue), it's just that all glues are designed to adhere to certain substances...and not others. PVC is really designed to cause adhesion between objects composed of wood fibers (ie. paper, wood, cardboard). PVC works with ballast because of the irregular nature of the ballast 'grains'. In a way, ballast is almost 'clumped' together as opposed to adhered. [As an aside: PVC will glue ballast to Styrofoam...but not as well as, say, Homesote or plywood.]

The inside of a styrene car is exceptionally smooth. Additionally styrene usually has some mold release material on it - from the molding process. The mold release 'stuff' can be washed off with soap, water and some type of mechanical abrasion (like an old toothbrush). So, the inside of a completed, sealed, tank car may be contaminated or will be very slick (because there is no definite way of cleaning the plastic and no way to 'roughen' it)...not good for PVC.

As far as epoxy goes, I guess I would go with one of those 5 minute (or longer) brands that are dispensed in a 'mixing' tube ('looks like 2 syringes joined together at the opening). A problem I see with this method is the size of the hole one would need to drill to allow the dispenser opening to protrude into the tank. [Some of these products come with a smaller nozzle.]

I guess if I had to 'weight' a completed tank car today, I would use BBs and PVC. The only caveat would be that the PVC/BB mix would extend slightly over half the diameter of the tank...if the PVC didn't 'hold' the mass couldn't go anywhere. There are many other epoxies out there; but I don't have any experience in their use.

Ray

[Len]

Ray,

These days I use a white glue called 'Weldbond', which seems to have a different consistency and "tackiness" than regular white glue. But even when I was using plain old 'Elmer's' white glue I never had any problems with the BB's coming loose.

Len

[jbrock27]

Thank you Ray and Len.

[jward]

Jeff, funny what you said about the Kadees-I just took delivery on a set 12 .  Would Kadee not honor you going to them and telling them the axles were warped, or did this warping occur over time/use?
If they were formed that way, is it easy enough for one to see a warped axle or is there a recommended test to determine that.

most of the kadees I had that warped did so after they were installed. there is an easy test to see if they are true or not. turn the car upside down and spin the axle. if both wheels wobble the axle is probably bent. this is not usually a problem with those brands which use metal axles so those are now what I buy. kadees and I think proto have plastic axles, Bachmann, intermountain, nwsl, reboxx and jaybee all have metal axles.

[Woody Elmore]

I recall a friend using bird shot instead of BBs. Wouldn't the shot be heavier - therefore requiring less of it?

[jbrock27]

You are correct Jeff, both Kadee and Proto 2000 (I have an order of them coming as well  ) have delrin axles.

Woody I believe you're right, bird shot, especially that made of lead, would be heavier than BBs.  Someone during the last discussion on the tanker weighting project mentioned using bird shot instead for the weight.

[Doneldon]

jb and Woody-

Bird shot won't be heavier than BBs because the Feds made lead shot for waterfowl illegal 20+ years ago, substituting steel. Birds which were just wounded were accumulating lead and so were water birds which feed on lake bottoms or fed on fish which bottom fed. This was eventually eaten by higher predators, including big fish, eagles and people, who were then poisoned by the lead. That's why eagles in the lower 48 were endangered; the lead made their egg shells too fragile to last until the chicks were ready to hatch. And people were experiencing lead poisoning symptoms like neurological and intellectual impairment, especially kids, if they ate much lead-contaminated fowl or fish. Eagles have made an astounding comeback and lead poisoning in people has pretty much disappeared except for children in poor families who still have exposed lead paint in their homes.

Someone may have a supply of lead shot for skeet or upland fowl hunting. There was a great hue and cry about the waterfowl steel shot requirements because it doesn't impact as hard so birds weren't killed unless hit squarely. I've lived on or near the Mississippi flyway since the mid-1960s so I've seen the eagles rebound for myself. You rarely saw eagles in the mid-60s and early 70s, except for close to the river, but the numbers came back very quickly after the lead ban was in place.

Now there is another big flapdoodle because the feds and environmentalists want a total ban on lead ammunition, even bullets not intended for birding. I'm not a hunter but I'm certainly concerned about lead in our environment. I think the ban is a good idea, but there are lots of folks who disagree with me quite strongly. My advice is that they learn to shoot more accurately so they don't have to worry about wounded birds, deer or whatever else they're hunting.
                                                                                                                                                               -- D

[Woody Elmore]

I forgot about the lead shot ban. I live 100 yards from Oyster Bay on Long Island and there are plenty of hunters during duck season. So they dump steel instead of lead into the bay!

Maybe asking the manufacturers to make a cast metal tank car frame would be the answer to the weighting problem. I remember HO tank cars with cast underframes - maybe it was Varney or MDC who did this.

[jbrock27]

In lieu of being able to obtain non steel bird shot, some states still allow for the use of lead fishing sinkers (States Rights n all).    Small, round lead sinkers may be found, close in size to BBs to use as a substitute for the BBs, which will provide greater added weight.