Spectrum K4 4-6-2 Service

[InterCity125]

Greetings all!

I'm just getting back into model railroading.  I had a K4 4-6-2 Spectrum locomotive that was broken (the rear drive wheel was out of sync and one of the rods had come loose).  I sent it in for service and found that they no longer repair the K4 and I was offered a replacement locomotive for a fee.

They offered me two replacements:
1. Spectrum 4-4-0
2. Non-Spectrum 2-8-4 Berkshire

I was told that although the 2-8-4 Berkshire is not boxed as a Spectrum, it is considered a Spectrum replacement because it is highly detailed and DCC-on board.

So my question is, are the regular Bachmann trains really as good as the Spectrum line now?  I hate to get the Berkshire and find it is not as refined or detailed as the old Spectrum K4.  Since I can't see either in person, I was hoping some folks on the forum could shed some light on this for me.  I will go with the 4-4-0 if it means keeping the same level of quality and detail, but if the regular Bachmann line is equal to my Spectrum K4, I'd consider the Berkshire.

Thanks! I just need some advice.

[Doneldon]

IC125-

Good questions. In theory, at least, Spectrum models have better detailing, quality and operating characteristics than the standard line. In practice that may not always be the case. For example, the venerable Spectrum Connie was demoted to the standard line without changes. It is, in effect, a Spectrum model in mufti. However, that doesn't mean that all standard line models are undercover Spectrums. (Spectra???)

Both the Spectrum American and the standard Berk are pretty good models. People on this board and elsewhere don't have many bad things to say about either one. The problem, as I see it, is that neither loco really fits the role of your K4.

The 4-4-0 is a light duty, antiquated locomotive which would look ridiculous pulling the Broadway Limited and the Berk wouldn't be much more believable. The American at least pulled a lot of (long ago) passenger trains; the 2-8-4s were designed and primarily used for fast freights. So ... what to do?

Beats me. But then it's not my railroad. Since neither engine is a credible pinch hitter for your once and future K4, I suggest that you decide which loco fits best (or maybe least poorly) with your railroading plans. Yes, there were 4-4-0s in service up until the 1950s, but only a few. Yes, the Berk was a sophisticated machine with most of the accoutrements we associate with the apotheosis of steam, but it never claimed the unapologetic glamour of a K4. So you're on your own. The American sells for about half again as much as the Berk, and it's a newer model. The Berk looks more like 20th Century railroading but it is an older model.

Get the one that works best for you. Both are decent products.

                                                                                                  -- D

[InterCity125]

Thanks Doneldon,

I really appreciate your insight.  The K4 was one of the last locomotives I received as a gift before I had to move and put my model railroad in storage.  As a result, I actually never completed the full train.  So in a sense, it is lucky because I don't have a set of passenger cars in need of an engine.

The K4 was a really nice engine, I was really hoping it could be fixed, but the damage looked pretty extensive, and I'm not sure it can be repaired without new parts.  So I think I will just try to take a pick out of the two options.  I'm leaning toward the 4-4-0 because I do not have anything like it yet and the detail looks incredible (something I admired about the K4).

Thanks again for your input.

[rogertra]

Thanks Doneldon,

I really appreciate your insight.  The K4 was one of the last locomotives I received as a gift before I had to move and put my model railroad in storage.  As a result, I actually never completed the full train.  So in a sense, it is lucky because I don't have a set of passenger cars in need of an engine.

The K4 was a really nice engine, I was really hoping it could be fixed, but the damage looked pretty extensive, and I'm not sure it can be repaired without new parts.  So I think I will just try to take a pick out of the two options.  I'm leaning toward the 4-4-0 because I do not have anything like it yet and the detail looks incredible (something I admired about the K4).

Thanks again for your input.

With the defunct K4 you can always do what I do with dead steam engines or those that no longer meet current performance or detail levels.  Heavily weather them, remove a few details such a one or more of the, side rods, headlight, generator, bell etc., etc., cover the stack with a piece of cloth (tissue paper) and consign it to your dead line.

Diesels, like all my old Athearns, Hobbytown etc.?  I give the operating ones away.  Junkers into the garbage.  There's always some young modeller around who doesn't care, yet, about era etc., and these old Athearn runners are good starter engines.  In fact, I give them my older rolling stock that doesn't meet current standards.

[ebtnut]

To add on to Donaldon's commentary - He's right about the 4-4-0; there were very few in service after the 1930's, and virtually all of them in either short line service or very light duty passenger serivce.  Interestingly, the Pennsy had a few D-16sb's in service into the early 1950's.  One of them is preserved at the Pennsylvania Railroad Museum in Strasburg, PA. 

The Berks were primarily intended for fast freight service, but many of them were equipped with extra hoses for steam heat and signalling so they could pressed into passenger service.  A lot of military troop trains during WWII were powered by dual-service Berks.  With 69 inch drivers, they could run at speeds close to the big-drivered passenger locos.  Note also that the Bachmann model represents what is referred to as a "Van Sweringen" Berk.  These locos were designed by a joint engineering committee for the Nickle Plate, Erie, C&O, Pere Marquette, and Wheeling and Lake Erie which were all controlled by the Vans.  All of these locos shared the same basic design, with some details such as dome style and placement and other applicances left to the home road. 

[Pacific Northern]

Consider yourself lucky, when I sent in an old 2-8-0 (with smoke) I was told the only locomotive that was available was a 2-6-2.

I asked it I could pay an additional fee and get something else. I was told no.

I asked if I could wait until there were other locomotives available, answer was no.

I took the 2-6-2 as it was that or the old locomotive coming back. I now wish i had taken the old locomotive back. I had forgot that a replacement drive train and motor are still being made, or at least still for sale.

Anyway I did complain on this board and received a PM from the Service Department.

I was told I should have had an option for another locomotive, but as they had mailed it out it was too late.

I do not know whey they bothered to send me the PM.

I would gladly paid more for a standard 2-8-0 or the new 2-6-0 (without DCC)

[InterCity125]

Yeah, I guess my only annoyance is that they are only offering me one true Spectrum engine, the 4-4-0, which just is not a great replacement for the K4.  I asked about getting one of the more expensive Spectrum engines and was told they are too expensive. 

They keep assuring me that the regular line is the same detail and running quality as my Spectrum K4.  Yet the K4 was sold as a Spectrum through 2012.  I just really like the Spectrum line but I only have one choice for replacement.

[Doneldon]

IC125-

The excellent Spectrum 2-8-0 recently was reclassified as a standard line loco which I think represents Bachmann's commitment to producing decent models for a fair price. I understand your frustration -- I'd probably feel the same way -- but I don't think you'll be disappointed with either option. Of course, that doesn't change the fact that neither is a credible substitute for the K4 which you no doubt purchased because you needed or wanted that particular model.

The B-man might hate me for suggesting this, but I wonder if you could sell a new-in-the-box 4-4-0 for enough to get a new K4 from an internet hobby shop or on eBay. There are seven new K4s on eBay this morning, beginning at a $90, free shipping, for one of the older ones on Buy-It-Now, and less than $200 for a new recent one. There are also a couple of auctions for new K4s. The modern 4-4-0s start on Buy-It-Now for $134.95 with free shipping.

However it goes down, I hope you're able to come up with an arrangement that works for you.

                                                                                                                                                -- D

[rogertra]

Yeah, I guess my only annoyance is that they are only offering me one true Spectrum engine, the 4-4-0, which just is not a great replacement for the K4.  I asked about getting one of the more expensive Spectrum engines and was told they are too expensive. 

They keep assuring me that the regular line is the same detail and running quality as my Spectrum K4.  Yet the K4 was sold as a Spectrum through 2012.  I just really like the Spectrum line but I only have one choice for replacement.

IIRC, from a Model Railroader review of several years ago, the Spectrum K4 was never really a "real" Spectrum engine but just the standard K4 slightly upgraded in order to add it to the Spectrum Line.  Sort of "faux Spectrum" if you will.