short curves

[longhaul]

I need to buy a new HO train set, I like Bauchmann and have a small area for a 48 x 48 inch layout. I would like to use some 15 degree track. I am trying to find out two things. I assume you would need 6 pieces of track for the 180 turn is that right? and second which Bauchmann HO train models run best on short radius turns
Thanks for your help,
Larry  lake Wales Fl.

[jward]

I would suggest that if 4x4 is all the room you have to seriously consider n scale. in over 40 years in this hobby, I have never seen a layout that used 15r curves without problems.

if you are able to expand to 4x6 or 4x8, you can do a workable HO layout using 18r and 22r curves that come in the train sets, and you'll have far fewer problems.

[longhaul]

Thanks Jeff, I do have a N Scale layout but find it difficult to work on the trains are so small I can,t do much with with them either.
Thanks for your advise, I may be able to add a few more inches to my space by moving my wifes sewing machine cabinet to the garage, good luck with that....
Larry

[ebtnut]

I would opt for 18" curves rather than 15" (note: model curves are measured by radius, not degrees of curvature like the prototype).  If you do go with 15", limit the rolling stock to four-wheel truck truck diesels such as F-units or Geeps for motive power and short freight cars in the 36 to 40 foot scale length.  With longer cars, the trucks can often rub against the center sill or other under-body parts causing wear and potential derailments. 

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

To answer one of the original questions, yes, you need six pieces of 15"-radius curves to make a 180-degree turn.

Also 0-4-0 steam locomotives and small 4-4-0 locomotives will all operate OK on 15"-radius curves. (Been there and done that a lot. ... )

[J3a-614]

Longhaul, you can work in a space of 48" by 48," although most of us would not consider it ideal; like the guys on "Home Improvement's" fictional "Tool Time" show, we always want "more power" (meaning a bigger layout)!  

Having said that, many others do work in that sort of space and even smaller, and some of those layouts are little jewels!  There's a whole website devoted to those small roads, too, and it's a most excellent site--the late Carl Arendt's Micro Layout page, now being run by others:

http://www.carendt.com/

Now, I've got to tell you, you're not likely to model 150-car coal drags or bullet trains in something like this.  You're going to have to work with things that fit, like switching roads, industrial lines, trolley lines, mining outfits, and the like.  But don't think you can't have fun and do some first class work in that form!

Want to see an example from the real world?

http://star.ap.teacup.com/1435prr/timg/middle_1229327217.jpg

This is on the Baltimore & Ohio's famous Pratt Street line, part of the original B&O.  It was street running, like a trolley car, going to factories and warehouses near the waterfront in Baltimore.  It's almost all gone now, but for a time it was a pretty busy place, and the B&O actually purchased a set of four state-of-the-art 0-4-0 tank locomotives for it in 1912.  These were the Docksides, and they ran into the early 1950s.  They were fairly large and heavy for the type, too, weighing 66 tons, giving them a 33-ton axle load.  That's pretty hefty even for main line power.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9977705@N05/6461092371/in/set-72157628365354533

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9977705@N05/6465505255/in/set-72157628365354533

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9977705@N05/sets/72157628365354533/

A fellow on this page named Jonathan had quite a ball rebuilding his grand-dad's Dockside from the 40s or 50s, and it proudly runs on his road today.

http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php/topic,11331.0.html

Anyway, have fun, and enjoy the challenge!

[longhaul]

WOW, I am amazed, I had 5 replys to my questions, thank you jward, ebnut,johnson bar jeff.23a-614, I learned something from each of you.
I think I can resize my layout to 39 x 48 and use 18 r for the curves and maybe still get an inner loop with 2 turnouts. All of my N stuff will be e-bay soon including the 33 buildings I hand made from very strong reinforced 1/8 wall cardboard. I think the building of a l/o is more fun and challenging than running the trains.
Thanks again guys
larry

[jward]

I built a twice around, over & under in 54x48 and kept the curves to 18r.

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

WOW, I am amazed, I had 5 replys to my questions, thank you jward, ebnut,johnson bar jeff.23a-614, I learned something from each of you.
I think I can resize my layout to 39 x 48 and use 18 r for the curves and maybe still get an inner loop with 2 turnouts.

Larry, someone may chime in that a width of 39 inches is not ideal--and I would agree--but many years ago I built a small layout--really, just a platform for track--sized for storage under a twin bed. I still have it and still use it from time to time. The platform is 39 x 54, and it has an outer loop of 18"-radius track and an inner loop of 15"-radius track. When I run trains on it, I'm very moderate (read: slow) about speeds, and I've never had a problem with derailments and trains making unexpected trips to the floor, even when I place the platform on top of a table.

So a 39-inch width can be done. On the 48 inch side, you'll be limited to one 9-inch straight section to turn the circle into an oval--pretty much like the loop of track that used to be packaged with a lot of train sets. By going with a 54-inch length on the long sides of my platform, I was able to have 15-inch straight sections on the long sides (one 9-inch section plus one 6-inch section).

JBJ

[K487]

Larry:

I'm a big Bachmann fan when it comes to HO engines (over 85% - I won't go into actual numbers, it's embarassing ).  However, I do have a few Atlas RS32s, and they will run easily with NO modifications around my tightest loop that has 180 degree, 11" radius curves.  (The "eleven inches" is not a typo.)  And yeah, I was surprised, but if it works......  The RS32 pulls a 32-car ore train so it doesn't look bad to me.

K487

[TimR]

Larry - One suggestion I might add is that if you are going for a small layout, try to size it slightly on the larger side. That is to say, don't size it to just barely fit your track size. By making it larger, you can angle the track as it sits on the layout so that none of the straights run parallel to the straight sides of the layout base. By doing this, along with some well placed scenery, you can give the impression that the layout is a little larger than it really is. This method is mentioned in a number of well known layout books but it sometimes gets overlooked by some modelers. I find that it works pretty good on all layouts, not just smaller ones. Good luck!