American Civil War Locomotives

[CROMWELL]

Looking at the Bachmann large scale locos, can anyone tell me which are American Civil War related all dates seem to be from 1876? exhibition but dont say what year they were built from. Regards. Harry

[richG]

Looking at the Bachmann large scale locos, can anyone tell me which are American Civil War related all dates seem to be from 1876? exhibition but dont say what year they were built from. Regards. Harry

As far as I know, none are Civil War era engines. Where did you get the idea the engine might be Civil War types?

Rich

[SteamGene]

I think any of the 4-4-0s could date from the War for Southern Independence.  The difference between an 1862 American Standard and an 1867 version was not that much, AFAIK.
Gene

[scottychaos]

I think any of the 4-4-0s could date from the War for Southern Independence.  The difference between an 1862 American Standard and an 1867 version was not that much, AFAIK.
Gene

except they arent 1862 or 1867..they are 1875.

the Bachmann F-scale spectrum 4-4-0 and 2-6-0 are based on mid 1870's prototypes.
although they probably wouldnt be terribly hard to back-date.
just need to go by a specific Cicil War loco, and see how well it matches..

The 4-4-0 is based on the "Eureka"..which still survives.
a 3-foot gauge Baldwin Class 8/18C built in 1875.

Im not sure of the exact prototype of the 2-6-0, but its a similar Baldwin design from the same era, just with a different wheel arrangement.
And the 2-6-0 is also referred to as the "Centennial 2-6-0"..referring to 1876.

so technically the Bachmann 4-4-0 and Spectrum 2-6-0 are 10 years beyond the civil war..which may not sound like much, but in terms of Steam Locomotive evolution, 10 years is a lot!

Scot

[Summertrainz]

Well from 1860-1865...
well there was the american 4-4-0 was a basic engine and nearing the end they introduced the consolidation 2-8-0...
look those up online
and bachmann probably has them.

[ebtnut]

Scotty is right--there was a big leap in design technology after the Civil War.  Take a look at pics from the Civil War and you will see that the loco designs were much closer to the 1850's than the 1870's, especially in terms of boiler designs and valve gears.  Even the "General", as currently preserved, bears little resemblance to the loco as it appeared during the "Chase". 

[Stephen Warrington]

EBTNUT,

Is Correct the General and Texas as preserved looks nothing like they did in 1862 during the Great Locomotive Chase. I am reading a wonderful book that just came out called "Stealing the General." That goes into great detail about the raid the chase and the aftermath including what happened to the locomotives. I have photos somewhere I took of the General I will have to find and upload to my photos site.

the Large scale Bachmann 4-4-0s and 2-6-0s very poor choice for the War of Northern Aggression Locomotive designs.

Even the  UPRRs 119 and CPRRs Jupiter were somewhat modernized compaired to the Locos used during the War.

Stephen

[SteamGene]

Shows what I don't know about steam prior to 1917! 
Gene

[ray tomblin]

Hello All,

You folks have me wondering about the civil war trains. I bought a Civil War train from Hawthorne Village which is a 2-6-0. It is suppose to be a model of the train used by General Lee. It is On30 scale and made by Bachman. I now have my doubts.

Ray 

[Dusten Barefoot]

I have the same set and the loco does not go back to the war between the states.

[THB-DAVE]

Hi Ray: the Hawthorne Village 2-6-0 with a Confederate theme is not a Civil war era engine nor is the rolling stock. Hawthornes Ad which has been in magazines for years does not claim it is a Civil era locomotive nor does it claim Robert E. Lee used it. It is abviousely a turn of the Century Mogul with a electic head light, which by the way did not exist in 1861 to 65. The ANV battle flag on the cars is even incorrectly proportioned and is not the Confederate national flag.

David

[ray tomblin]

David,

Thanks for the Information. I have been feeling all along that they sold me a pile of goods. I knew the flags were not right based on the Civil War books I have. I am also a member of the Civil War Preservation Trust and they had nothing on it that would help me.

Ray

[Great Western]

Hi,
         A very interesting thread and giving us on the eastern side of the Atlantic Ocean a good lesson in American history and the evolution of locos.

   We have many preserved locos in the UK dating from the 19th. century but only one or two are in the "as built" state, most were rebuilt or had substantial additions made to them.

  Also notable is the thread originators name.  Oliver Cromwell was of course the main player in the English Civil War.

  I note with interest the alternative names for the conflict -  I have added a logo on one of my UTLX Bachmann tank cars of the Dixie Oil company.  I have been informed on another American Forum that it is not politically
correct.   

[THB-DAVE]

Hi Ray: I am a Civil War reenactor with the 10th Loisianna and our group yearly makes a donation to the Civil War Preservation Trust. Just recently one of our members asked me about that the Hawthorne Village 2-6-0 and I told him what I told you. The Ad can be misleading.

David

[scottychaos]

Here is a proper (late) Civil War era loco: 




The Lehigh Valley Railroad's "Consolidation"
the worlds first 2-8-0 road engine.
built by Baldwin in 1865.

The loco's name "consolidation" was in honor of the consolidation of two railroads, the Lehigh & Mahoning and the Lehigh Valley. (although in reality it was not a "merger of equals"..the larger LV essentially took over the smaller L&M!

Later, all 2-8-0 locomotives took the name "consolidation" after this particular loco, the first 2-8-0.

Even though this loco is from 1865, its a VERY modern loco for the civil war era..and much larger and heavier than most locos that operated during the war..so its really not a great representative loco for the war era..most locos that actually operated during the war would have been more primitive and based on technology from the 1855-1865 era...and the vast majority were 4-4-0's.

I found a few historic pictures on-line,
a famous photo of a bombed-out loco from the war:
http://www.old-picture.com/civil-war/pictures/Locomotive-Civil-War.jpg
thats 1840's technology there!

Here is  a classic Civil War era 4-4-0!
http://www.archives.gov/research/civil-war/photos/images/civil-war-081.jpg
The "General Haupt" was built by the Mason Machine works in 1862.


Here are a few more beautiful photos:

"Depot of the U.S. Military Railroads, City Point, Va., 1864"
http://www.archives.gov/research/civil-war/photos/images/civil-war-084.jpg

"U.S. Military Railroads engine No.137, built in l864 in the yards at Chattanooga, Tenn., with troops lined up in the background."
http://www.archives.gov/research/civil-war/photos/images/civil-war-085.jpg

The engine "Firefly" on a trestle of the Orange and Alexandria Railroad.
http://www.archives.gov/research/civil-war/photos/images/civil-war-086.jpg

the last four links are all from:
http://www.archives.gov/research/civil-war/photos/

Scot