Old Timers' Reminiscing

[ebtnut]

On the layout plan, if my memory serves it was in the old "101 Track Plans" book.

[richg]

does anybody remember an old model railroader book of layout plans which contained a mountain railroad called the ute central?

my first layout was an adaptaion of this layout, and i'd like to get a copy of this book but can't seem to find it.

Is this what you might be looking for?



Rich

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

My grandfather bought me an MRC Dual Throttlepak (which is what we used to run the Great Northern Pacific). I did a Google search and couldn't locate an image of this transformer. I do remember it 'humming' and getting rather warm to the touch after a lengthy operating session. I saw the same throttlepak for sale (in rather poor condition) at last weekend's train show...'guess they are still around.

Ray

I can't say for sure, but I think that might be the power pack we had on the "train table" my grandfather built for me. I was very young when he built it--possibly just kindergarten age, maybe even younger; I'm afraid I just don't remember for sure.

Grandpa taught electrical shop at a trade school. I remember being told that he had the boys in wood shop make the actual table; it was 4 ft. by 8 ft., nicely framed, with a sheet of homasote on top of a sheet of plywood, and edging that was flush with the top of the homasote.

Grandpa laid the track (brass Atlas Snap-track--it was the early 1960s) and did the wiring; the track plan, a double oval, with one very long spur off the innner loop and a double crossover, looked very much like an old Atlas plan, except that the two tracks were exactly parallel, so that it looked like a double-track main line railroad. He had both loops broken up into blocks, with power controlled by SPST switches gathered into a control box in one corner of the table. There were also on-off switches for power to both loops, and a switch for the crossover--I never did understand how that worked!

And that was the real trouble with that layout--it was way too sophisticated for the small boy that I was. Perhaps if it had had a control panel with a track diagram to show the blocks, that might have helped, but I never really could make the connection between most of the switches on the control box and the actual tracks. One thing I could do, though: Grandpa included an old American Flyer whistle, with a pushbutton on the control box to control it, and you can be sure this little boy learned how to blow the whistle!  I think that whistle drove my mother crazy--that may be why the "train table" was only set up in early December and was taken down right after New Year's.  The table was set up in the basement; it wasn't like it was filling up half the living room. 

Anyway, power for the railroad was some brand of dual throttle power pack that was mounted to the table on the same end but in the opposite corner from the control box. It hummed and got warm after the trains had been running for a while.

I remember that when Grandpa did any repairs on the table, he had the bad habit of starting and stopping trains with the on-off switches on the control box, rather than with the rheostats on the power pack; that drove me crazy once I got old enough to learn to use the knobs on the power pack to slow trains to a stop.

That table lasted well into my 20s, until I was living and working away from home. I was thinking of offering it to my best buddy from high school, who by then had two little boys of his own, both of whom loved trains, but before I could do that, my mother asked me if I'd mind if she offered it to the neighbors for their grandson, so I just told her to go ahead and do that. I sometimes wonder what the neighbors ended up doing with that old train table. 

[ebtnut]

Those old power packs from the '50's and '60's had large transformers inside to step the power down from 110v to about 14v.  Then the lower voltage went through a silicon rectifier unit to covert to DC.  The transformers generate heat, which is why the case gets warm.  If you get a substantial short, and there is no circuit breaker, the transformer can get REALLY hot.  The rheostats, because they are in essence a variable resistor, can also get warm.   

Because a lot of accessories back then used AC, like that American Flyer whistle, the better packs had terminals on the back for regulated DC for the trains, unregulated DC for some accessories, and low-voltage AC for others.

[richg]

Those old power packs from the '50's and '60's had large transformers inside to step the power down from 110v to about 14v.  Then the lower voltage went through a silicon rectifier unit to covert to DC.  The transformers generate heat, which is why the case gets warm.  If you get a substantial short, and there is no circuit breaker, the transformer can get REALLY hot.  The rheostats, because they are in essence a variable resistor, can also get warm.   

Because a lot of accessories back then used AC, like that American Flyer whistle, the better packs had terminals on the back for regulated DC for the trains, unregulated DC for some accessories, and low-voltage AC for others.

Those old rectifiers could really stink when overloaded.

Rich

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

Because a lot of accessories back then used AC, like that American Flyer whistle, the better packs had terminals on the back for regulated DC for the trains, unregulated DC for some accessories, and low-voltage AC for others.

Sure enough! That American Flyer whistle got its power from the AC hookup on the transformer. 

[Desertdweller]

I had one of those MRC Dual Packs.  It was a pretty good unit for its day.  The things I liked about it were the metal case, the taper-wound rheostats, the cranks on the throttle knobs, and the on-off switch on the power packs.

Taper-wound rheostats were an improvement over normal rheostats, in that they had wider spacing between windings at the low-speed end of the coil, the space becoming tighter as the wiper approached the high end of the coil.  This had the effect of providing a greater output for control knob movement when starting.  This was nice when starting a train from a dead stop.

They had the same drawbacks as other rheostats, heating up with use, especially at low speeds.

In another attempt to improve performance, the pack featured "pulse power".  This used only half the wave of the AC converted to DC, 30 hertz.  This was like a "low gear" for switching, but was noisy and would heat up motors quickly.  New generation packs would automatically use pulse when starting, then gradually replace it with full-wave rectified AC at higher throttle settings.  On the Dual Packs, this pulse power was turned on or off with a simple slide switch.  There was no way to smoothly transition from pulse power to normal running.  If you didn't want a bad slack run-out, you could not go from "granny gear" to normal running.

As the pack heated up, it would expand and buzz.  This was a problem with all rheostat-controlled packs.

MRC powerpacks have always been fine machines for their day.  After about ten years of the Dual Pack, I replaced it with a Dual Tech II 2800 MRC unit.  It has the faults of the earlier pack corrected, and has served me well for over thirty years.

Les

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

In another attempt to improve performance, the pack featured "pulse power".  This used only half the wave of the AC converted to DC, 30 hertz.  This was like a "low gear" for switching, but was noisy and would heat up motors quickly.  New generation packs would automatically use pulse when starting, then gradually replace it with full-wave rectified AC at higher throttle settings.  On the Dual Packs, this pulse power was turned on or off with a simple slide switch.  There was no way to smoothly transition from pulse power to normal running.  If you didn't want a bad slack run-out, you could not go from "granny gear" to normal running.

I remember that feature of my power pack. That was another feature that, as a little kid, I had no idea what it was for!   

[CNE Runner]

I had a copy (actually I thought I still "had" that copy...but can't find it) of 101 Track Plans. That may have been where I saw the layout plan in question. One can only assume that the book was sold at one of our train shows. If I remember (yeah...that might actually happen), I will look for a copy at the Birmingham train show next weekend.

I remember those early zamac metal pieces deteriorating. Some time ago, I started construction on an early Red Ball flat car kit. The supplied truck bolsters were made of zamac and had deteriorated in the kit box. I guess the kit (obtained from eBay) had been subjected to humidity in its past.

Another problem with purchasing these old kits is that the paper overlays are rapidly beginning to decompose. Most of the overlays were made from printed paper (or lighter card stock). Paper is a magnet for humidity and will begin to brown and/or grow brittle with age ('has to do with the acidity of the paper product...look at what happends to newsprint after a couple of years). I suggest you look over any of these kits with a careful eye...any that have overlays that have become (or started to become) brown should be passed over. Another possible course of action would be to scan the original overlays, digitally remove as much browning as you can, then print out new overlays on suitable card stock.

Someone mentioned the glues that were available in the days of yore. In addition to 'pot glues' there were the two mentioned. Pot glues are made from animal renderings and were extensively used in the furniture industry. While they worked well (sort of) in furniture, they fell short of the mark in modeling. Usually these glues 'dried out' over time and lost their adhesion. [That could be why so many of the completed old time car kits are seen to be falling apart.]

Ray

[jward]

rich,

thanks. now i know what book it was in. finding it may be a problem though.

how i built the ute short line, in the original version of small model railroads you can build. unfortunately, everybody online seems to be selling later versions of this book, which have completely different layout plans.

i will continue my search....

[ebtnut]

In those days before ACC and epoxy, almost none of the adhesive we had available were truly "permanent".  Ambroid did OK for wood to wood or paper to wood, but not metal to anything.  Pot glue and white glue again did pretty good for wood to wood but not much else.  About the only real option for wood to metal or metal to metal was Walthers Goo, but even it would dry out over the years and parts would begin to fall off.  I'm sure this was at least part of the reason many of the kits used screws and small brass pins in assembly, even if there was some loss of precise detail. 

[Doneldon]

Model Die Casting sold freight car kits which were all zamac. You had to screw them together and there was never a question of adding weight. Those things weighed a ton but they sure sat right down on the rails and stayed there. Painting them was a problem until we realized we had to wash them thoroghly to remove the mold release. I still have some of these.

There were also kits, including Silver Streak, which had nicely painted and decorated sides but bare wood everything else. The instruction sheet would say which paint number from which manufacturer to use to match the prepainted sides. In those days, that usually meant Floquil.

I remember the first time I saw an ad for Floquil paint. It ballyhooed scale pigments. I thought that was just about the most ridiculous thing I had ever heard. Then I thought about it for a while, looked at a few models I had buried under Testor's pla and realized they were on to something. And I stuck with Floquil exclusively until the acrylics came out. I mostly use the acrylics now, but I  keep a good supply of Floquil around, too.
                                                                                                                                                                                  -- D

[CNE Runner]

Don - I remember those all-metal, heavy MDC cars. Couple two or three to an early Athearn locomotive (with Hi-F drive) and not much of anything happened. As an aside, you solved a problem I had, as a kid, with painting metal cars...the paint streaked or didn't stay on at all. [A 13 year-old's solution?...lay the paint on heavier.] I never thought to wash the cars before painting (something that I routinely do today).

Ye Olde Huff n' Puff still offers some of the old Silver Streak and Mainline kits. It probably would do us good to attempt to build at least one of them (no more cranes for this guy though). Possibly by building one of these older kits we can appreciate how far kits have come (especially the styrene ones).

We used diluted house, or Testor's, paint on the early kits. I do remember using Scalecoat for the first time and was amazed at how easily it flowed on the surface. Dad always had me seal the assembled wooden parts with shellac or lacquer (I don't remember which). This sealed the grain and provided a smooth surface to glue those overlays to. Nowdays I get most of my paint from either Walmart or Hobby Lobby (and occasionally a 'special color' from an LHS).

Ray

PS: I just bought a near-perfect Athearn Little Hustler on eBay. With a new set of rubber bands I can now say that Monks' Island is 'missile equipped'. The Hustler is mainly for show and will join my Bachmann MDT/WDT as the beginning of my 'critter' collection. Hmmm, 'might have the Trackmobile join them.

[Desertdweller]

I had one of those MDC metal cars, a gon.  It came factory painted and lettered for BN.  This was soon after the original BN merger, so it must have been one of the first models offered in that paint scheme.

It sure did not need any extra weigh!

It came with horn-hook couplers like everything else did back then in HO.  Their coupler used a plastic hook and shank, and a thin metal wire spring, and did not like to stay coupled with other makers' horn hook couplers.

Les

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

PS: I just bought a near-perfect Athearn Little Hustler on eBay. With a new set of rubber bands I can now say that Monks' Island is 'missile equipped'. The Hustler is mainly for show and will join my Bachmann MDT/WDT as the beginning of my 'critter' collection. Hmmm, 'might have the Trackmobile join them.

Uh-oh! Sounds like the collecting bug has bit!   

It got me, too, a number of years ago, which is why I scour eBay every day for late-50's--early-60's Mantua/Tyco.