New Locomotive Suggestions

J3a-614 · August 13, 2011, 08:16:53 PM

You want to know what's really weird about those engines? They were considered failures by their original owner, and those shortcomings made them unliked by about all their subsequent owners.

The N&W built them for fast freight service, but they had counterbalance problems, due to smallish drivers for the speeds N&W needed for them (their replacements were the famous and successful Class A 2-6-6-4s); despite this, they did run on passenger trains in the early part of WW II, when the N&W needed anything that could do the job. As it turned out, the A was a good passenger locomotive for heavy troop trains, so the engines became available, and that's how they wound up on D&RGW and RF&P. They were somewhat outdated on the D&RGW by this time (the road already "graduating" to big Baldwin 4-8-4s and 4-6-6-4s), and were absolutely hated on the RF&P, which had a lot of hotshot operations behind a fleet of beautiful Baldwin 4-8-4s, a handful of their own 4-8-2s, some Lima 2-8-4s purchased under wartime restrictions, and a bunch of dual-service 4-6-2s (the RF&P, like the Florida East Coast it had indirect connections with, was a relatively flat road, and as I recall, was one of the few in the US to never roster a 2-8-2).

It's some indication of their lack of popularity that they were only on their respective second owners' roads for the duration of WW II. They wound up on the W&LE because they were available cheap; the road needed additional power in the postwar era, but the merger with NKP was already in the works (it would take place in 1948 or 1949--got to look that up), and the management didn't want to spend too much money on new power that would mostly work for the successor, so they went shopping, and brought home what the W&LE crews called the "Water Buffaloes." They had a reputation for being cranky and cantankerous on that road (partially due to their age and wear by then), and that carried on into the NKP years. I understand they didn't last but a few years after the merger, while a number of other older W&LE engines, including 2-8-0s, USRA heavy 2-8-2s, and USRA 2-6-6-2s all outlasted them.

Fascinating history for power that was considered a failure!

Now, the question is, does this justify Bachmann tooling up for a locomotive that numbered only 10 units, was considered a failure, and is rather obscure?

NWsteam · August 13, 2011, 10:39:34 PM

Yeah, no thanks on the K-3. You can get a brass one for a decent price on ebay these days. They show up alot. My vote is for an N&W M 4-8-0.

My other vote would be for a 2 truck shay.

Not sitting around and waiting...I already bought a brass two truck shay and I'm saving for the M.

-Brad

ebtbob · August 13, 2011, 11:53:20 PM

Brad,

Whatever you do, when looking for the 4-8-0, stay away from the one from Sunset. It is beautifully done, but low geared and does not pull worth a dime. I had one for a while and on a flat track with good rolling cars it hauled about 8-10 cars. On a grade of less than one percent, that number of cars dropped down to about 4 cars. BTW....the engine had decent weight.

Doneldon · August 14, 2011, 01:45:21 AM

ebtbob-

What about putting a larger can motor in the Sunset Mastadon?

-- D

J3a-614 · August 14, 2011, 10:24:46 AM

EBT, what would happen with the Sunset model in a stall? Did the engine slip, or did it just stop, without the wheels turning? And was the low-speed performance otherwise good, i.e., would the engine creep nicely as we want them to do for switching?

jettrainfan · August 14, 2011, 03:35:57 PM

A diesel: BL-2 or slug or cow/calf... funny... they all fit together. Cow/calf is like a switcher companion, which includes a slug of some king, and a BL-2 used slugs!

NWsteam · August 14, 2011, 06:55:53 PM

EBT Bob- This is very interesting to know! I have talked to many people about the sunset model and I have heard nothing but praise. What run did you own?

Re-motering would be an option but it would be a lot of work because of the lack of room(space is also an issue for a decoder install). Or I could contract the work out... = lots of money. I don't know if my skills are up to the task.

I've also watched for the PSC 4-8-0 M2c to be on sale online every once in awhile. They are expensive, but gorgeous locomotives.

It would be really nice if Bachmann would make one and save me the time and money.

-Brad

ryeguyisme · August 14, 2011, 07:16:16 PM

i wouldnt mind a couple 4-8-0's

jward · August 14, 2011, 08:23:12 PM

Quote from: jettrainfan on August 14, 2011, 03:35:57 PM
A diesel: BL-2 or slug or cow/calf... funny... they all fit together. Cow/calf is like a switcher companion, which includes a slug of some king, and a BL-2 used slugs!

the calf unit is not like a slug. it is the switcher equivalent of a b unit.

bl2s have been put out by proto2000, i believe in several runs.

slugs, the problem with modelling slugs is that they are all custom built, and every road that operated slugs built them to different designs. they do make good kitbashing projects.

btw, the bl2 on most roads didn't last long. only on bangor & aroostook and western maryland did they last into the 1970s and 1980s. and only the wm used them with slugs.

probably the simplest slugs to model would be the road slugs of csx. you'd take a bachmann gp30 or gp35, blank out all the air intakes and remove the radiator fans and, instant slug......

jettrainfan · August 14, 2011, 10:58:59 PM

jward, That's actually a road slug, its like a cab unit. I see them on the yard transfers that pass through berea around noon on the CSX line, interesting units. Caught a pair being dropped off at collinwood about 3 weekends ago on a mixed freight.

Eman627 · August 23, 2011, 11:55:03 AM

How about a Southern Ps-4 or a 3 truck Heisler? (Specifically Cass #6)
Or even a re-release of the two truck climax WITH improved gears.
I very much approve of a N&W 4-8-0 being added to the range.

ebtbob · August 25, 2011, 08:52:09 AM

Good Morning All,

Sorry for the delay in answering you questions. I think I got my 4-8-0 when they were announced, what 10-12 years ago? My version would slip when to many cars were behind the draw bar. I loved the way the engine looked, but not pulling, say 10 cars up my 1% or less grade, did not set well with me.
For those interested, if you are wondering about the N&W 4-8-0, there is one running on the Strasburg Railroad in PA. Also, here is a pic of an N&W 4-8-0 with the tender I am would love to see on a model from Bachmann.

rogertra · August 25, 2011, 09:25:17 PM

Anything that's not an odd ball. So no 4-8-0s or 4-4-2s or tank engines of any kind. (Sorry guys)

Something that's not obviously a design of a particular railroad. (No more Pennsy anything, or Sunset Limiteds etc., etc..)

Something that's not articulated. (Way too many of them already)

Something that's not too big. Smaller than say a 4-8-4 (No more 2-10-4 etc..)

How about a good quality generic looking, though it may be prototypical, 4-6-2 or even a 4-8-4?

jettrainfan · August 26, 2011, 04:34:07 PM

A galloping goose, or other hi rail vehicle similar to it? that's not really been made (i know con-cor made a galloping goose earlier, but i found it for $200...)

ryeguyisme · August 26, 2011, 04:47:36 PM

Quote from: jettrainfan on August 26, 2011, 04:34:07 PM
A galloping goose, or other hi rail vehicle similar to it? that's not really been made (i know con-cor made a galloping goose earlier, but i found it for $200...)

MDC roundhouse made a 3 in 1 kit also, if you're talking On30 then sure maybe but HO and HOn3 have already been done.

a decent american mikado should be next at least

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New Locomotive Suggestions