Brass Question- NWSL

[NWsteam]

Where does Northwest Short line Brass fall in the lineup of brass manufactures? Good running products or stay away? Jonathan's project might have convinced me to try my own Brass project...

-Brad

[richg]

I have been following the NWSL products for many yeas. Their re-gear, re-motor and wheels are excellent products. I use some of them. They have been having issues getting motors as the over seas supplier closed up I believe.
I email Dave, the owner at times and he always responds.
Do a Google search for NWSL.
Dave came up with a solution for the Spectrum Shay cracking gear issue that provides a quality steel gear.

Rich

[GN.2-6-8-0]

NWSL has'nt imported any brass locomotives in quite a few years probably not since the 70s ,most were not in the class of the higher Japanese builders such as Tenshodo but they were concidered fairly good runner's.

[NWsteam]

I was asking about the past locomotive offerings but good to know I can still get in touch with someone about re gearing/re-motoring. I also have a shay that seems its gears have just started slipping. Good to know since it seems they are out of stock at Bachmann. Thanks Rich.

GN.2-6-8-0 - Your comment about Tenshodo is very interesting. I have read many places that Tenshodo brass always had a distinctive growl when run that earned several nicknames none of which I will repeat here. Are they good runners in your opinion? I've never owned or operated brass so I'm just trying to feel my way into the market. Thanks for your reply.

-Brad

[NWsteam]

The reason I ask about Tenshodo is because I'm looking at any small N&W steam locomotive. They produced an S1 0-8-0 that seems to be for sale several places online. Still a little wary of buying brass online. I've have also looked at NWSL E2a 4-6-2. Any of course I'm always on the hunt for an M 4-8-0. Just trying to weigh the pros/cons and of course, price will play a big factor.

[jonathan]

Brad,

As I've only worked on one brass loco, doubt I could be much help.  However, here's a couple of observations/opinions.

Brass is expensive, and takes a lot of work to get running well, by today's standards.

I was going to start on an NWSL 2-6-2T as a beginner loco.  The cost was less than anything else I could find, and was told it ran pretty good from the start.

I chose the PFM 0-8-0 because of cost.  It was missing parts and didn't have an original box.  That made it the most inexpensive brass piece I could find.  In fact, the motor/working parts, detail parts, paint and tools cost pretty close to the same as the cost of the loco itself.  The fact that it turned out to be a B&O piece was pure luck.

If this is your first time, as mine was, I would focus on economics, rather than quality or roadname.  All the brands have nice detail on their pieces.

Another opinion:  eBay scares me.  Is theire any way you can hold off and hit a big train show?  I would want to see the piece in person before I invested in such a pricey item.  That's just me. Call me paranoid I guess.
Good Luck in your search.

Regards,

Jonathan   

[NWsteam]

Jonathan- I don't plan to buy online. I've found something at the LHS. One of my other options is online (Caboose hobbies). I agree with you about eBay!

As to expense I agree with except I will stick to one roadname. I'm made it a rule that if I'm going to spent big bucks it has to be N&W. It helps me cut down on buying whatever looks nice(Alot stuff).

Perhaps if one spends more money out of the gate, you will spent less in repair/detail parts later? I bet that's not always true but in this case I think it will be. The model seems to be in good condition. I will have to wait till I can see it run at the LHS.

[NWsteam]

How do you go about painting? Take it apart...then what?

[Woody Elmore]

Back in the heyday of brass, PFM imported the best. They had models made by Tenshodo, United and Fuji. Tenshodo started after WWII when American GIs had them custom build U.S.models. They may still be in business in Japan. PFM was only the exporter. The owner of PFM, Bill Ryan, would order a run of a certain type of model and Tenshodo or United would make them. If I recall correctly Tenshodo engines were always factory painted. As for noise, yes there was a little gearbox growl, but that was not uncommon.

To paint any brass engine requires nerve and some skill. Nerve, in that, you have lots of little screws and springs to remove. Then comes the painting. Jon's recent upgrade of a B&O switcher should give you some idea of the complexity of the project. It is a task not meant for the faint hearted.

I have no experience with NWSL engines so I can't comment on them. I can tell you to stay away from some of the later offerings from Westside (often in a red white and blue box) and also avoid Empire Midland engines.

[jonathan]

Painting is not my strong suit, but here's how I did it.

I read everything I could find, online, about painting brass.  Then...

Loco Shell:

I was going to paint over the lacquer coating as some have suggested.  Seemed like a good idea.  But then I found some of the lacqer was chipped off, probably from my manhandling. So, plan B...

I put the shell in an old cooking pot, added a quart of water and two tablespoons of baking soda.  I then hardboiled the shell for 30 minutes... twice!  That took off most of the lacquer.  What remained was some gooey clumps around the stanchions and little corners.  I was able to pick out most of it with a sharpened toothpick.

I then soaked the shell in regular paint thinner (24 hours), which seemed to have removed the remainder of the goo.  Didn't try to shine the brass as I was going to paint it.

Then, I soaked the shell in vinegar overnight.  This supposedly etches the brass so the paint will stick to it better.

I used a dark gray primer (spray bomb) for the first coat.  I warmed the can in a sink of hot water while I washed the shell one last time.  I used a hair dryer to completely remove any dampness.

I made a paint stand out of some 1X3 pine and shaped it so the shell would sit on the stand securely.  You can see it in some of the pics.

The primer coat is thin and looks great.  Let dry for at least 24 hours.  I baked the shell, in the oven for 30 minutes between coats (175 deg. F).

The second coat was a glossy black (Testor's Classic Black).  The gloss coat goes on thick.  It's hard to work with.  Takes some practice.  Even then the gloss coat doesn't look real smooth when dry. Again, I baked it.

Then went on the decals and any fine painting required... I put some flat brown on the arm rest to simulate some sort of padding.  Of course, some microsol on the decals to meld them to the shell.

Finally, I put one, relatively thin coat of dullcote over the whole thing.  That made the paint job look much better.  Let dry for 48 hours.

I used two thin coats of neolube on the smokebox and the front of the boiler.  I like the color when it dries.  The neolube looks better over time.  It will look a little rough at first.

I brush painted the headlight and handrails on the smokebox front.  I used a tamiya paint, X-29 semigloss I believe.

The smaller parts:  steam chest, pilot... etc were painted in a similar fashion, without removing the lacquer.

The underframe was painted with floquil grimy black and some dullcote.  You have to sand off the paint where current needs to move from the wheels to the motor wire.  And I left the bottom plate attached while painting.  The really hard part is putting the wheels back on.  Those little springs are a bear.  Make sure you remember to orient the wheels so pick up is on the right side.

The wheels, rods and valve gear were painted with neolube, while disassembled.  After assembling, another coat of neolube is necessary.  Don't try to seal the neolube with dullcote.  Trust me, you won't like the results! 

Some folks have painted the entire underframe, wheels and all, while assembled.  You have to turn the wheels while painting.  Then remove the paint from the wheel treads.  I am not that brave.

Oh, I brush painted the valve gear hangar.  That way I could leave some of the valve gear parts attached.  I was worried about losing and/or stripping those tiny screws.

Get a magnifying glass and a bright light to work with.

Regards,

Jonathan

[ebtnut]

NWSL brass models were in the good to quite good category for their time.  Decent detail, and most ran pretty well.  I echo the sentiment that you should not buy a brass model sight unseen.  I generally class the Fuji models from PFM at the top, followed by United and Tenshodo.  The factory paint on Tenshodos was always nice, but didn't quite off-set the mechanims, which tended to be noisy. 

[richg]

I purchased a NWSL 0-8-0T made by Toby and it runs OK. Typical vertically mounted motor with the worm driving the worm gear on the rear driver axle. I wish I could convert it to a compound drive but that would be a lot of work, machining.
I might contact Dave at NWSL to see if he has a better worm to worm gear match for this loco.
The detail is quite nice though.
Picked it off of ebay for about $200.00 a couple years ago.
It very closely resembles the below prototype and is labeled the same, PRR.

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr8542s.jpg

Rich

[Doneldon]

anybody-

I've purchased a number of brass locos on ebay and I've never experienced any problems. You can always send it back. I did have a problem with a Bachmann large scale 2-4-2 some years ago but Bachmann fixed it for a reasonable price. The thing with the brass locos is only buy when the photos are actually focused, when you know what the item is worth, when the seller has stellar (did you like that? Sat it aloud.) feedback and when your questions are promptly amswered.

                                                                                        -- D