Question for all you kitbashers and IC fans

[Stephen Warrington]

Hi Guys,

I just got my 2nd 2-8-0 from Bachamnn and when I sat it in front of my two lemon Hallmark 2-8-0s the loco dementions matched perfect now here is the question. Would a new Bachmann chassis and motor fit on a Hallmark Boiler?



here's a shot with them side by side. The RI will soon be senttoTexas for conversion into a IC 2-8-0 or a close copy of one.

Stephen

[Orsonroy]

I tried it Stephen; it won't work.

The Hallmark boiler may be just a hollow brass tube, but that's not quite how the Bachmann boiler and scassis are designed. The boiler shell is designed so it wraps around a solid metal weight inside the engine, that does double duty as support for some of the motor components, and which also acts as the lower edge of the boiler itself.

I suppose that it IS possible, but it'll take a lot of milling time to get the brass boiler to sit on the Bachmann chassis. It's a real shame too; if the Bachmann models were designed more conventionally (like the BLI engines) it'd be REALLY easy to pop off their boilers and add all sorts of new boilers to their excellent drive trains.

[lanny]

Hi guys,

I've been 'incommunicado' the past several days due to the very important, fun and exhausting job of overseeing 4 lively grand kids while parents were gone.

I have Ray's Paducah sand dome pattern finished except for details and will be sending it to you in just a few days, hopefully, Ray.

Stephen, I need to paint my 2-8-0 Bachmann Spec boiler and do the tender for ICRR 908. It came out well IF the paint comes out well!

Neither IHC or Spectrum seem to lend themselves to easily putting kit bashed or scratched boilers on their running mechanisms. Which as Ray (Orsonroy) mentioned is a shame because the Spectrum is such a nice runner (and the IHCs are good runners too).

If I ever have to tear my 2-8-0 apart to have the motor worked on, much of the detail will have to be removed which will be a real pain!

Make sure your Bachmann is in top running condition and all is in perfect working order (as much as you can) before sending it off for 'kit bashing'.

lanny nicolet

[ap0317ah]

stephen

I may be new to this forum but I am not new to railroading. over 20 years time i can tell you i have done my fair share of bashs. The hallmark (HMK) loco may not be the best canadate for a boiler swap but the you could cut and swap domes and other boiler details.(this would require some kitbashing skill) then theres the diffentices in the icrr's front pilot deck you could take theses details from the HMK or make them or find them.

best of luck
   Tom      

[Orsonroy]

stephen

I may be new to this forum but I am not new to railroading. over 20 years time i can tell you i have done my fair share of bashs. The hallmark (HMK) loco may not be the best canadate for a boiler swap but the you could cut and swap domes and other boiler details.(this would require some kitbashing skill) then theres the diffentices in the icrr's front pilot deck you could take theses details from the HMK or make them or find them.   

Tom,

Unfortunately, about the only thing worth saving on those old brass clunkers are the tenders. That "Paducah dome" they added to the model looks nothing like any dome Paducah ever made, and is worthless as a detail part. As for the rest of the detailing, the basics are either exactly like the Bachmann model or are so bad as to need complete replacing.

Take a look at the model of 908 that Lanny's building: it's a near-perfect model of 908, which is what those brass "things" should look like.

[ap0317ah]

that is true but was his orginal idea not just to mount the body onto the bachmann. now a browser Paducah domes are correct. so he either roll his own or buy one

[lanny]

Hi ap0317ah

In an erlier thread at the very bottom of the page, if you are interested, you will find some photos of the ICRR consolidation that Orsonroy is referring too. It actually now has even more details. If you are interested in seeing the thread please look for "Progress on 908 Kit bash". It's now on about page 4 of the HO posts on the forum.

As for Bowser "Paducah domes", I purchased several. They are too small for the 2-8-) consolidation, and though with some filing and sanding work can be made to resemble ICRR Paducah sand domes, they really only look right on, according to Orsonroy, on ICRR switchers or smaller locomotives. For the Connies, Mikes, Mountains and 2-10-2s ... you really need much larger domes and, besides that, they come in a variety of shapes.

Here is a photo of my first major steam kit bash project: an ICRR 2-10-2 using Bowser Paducah domes ... the front dome is just too small ... the back one is about right, but it required lots of sanding and shaping to get it to look right.



lanny nicolet

[ap0317ah]

yes and is that not the part of kitbashing if you can not find the proper part you mod. it or make your own? that is the what is great about this hobby you are not held go to someone elses interpation of how things should be done there are many ways to go about it.

Tom

[lanny]

I agree, Tom. If a person has the 'skills', 'tools', 'time' and desire to fabricate the parts they need for a true prototypical 'kit bash', that's great.

Unfortunately, for me at least, I don't have those really great 'craftsman' skills and/or 'tools' necessary to do such super fine scale modeling. Being a retired commercial artist, illustrator, ... I use my 'eyeballs' to judge how things 'should' look ... I almost never do careful 'scale' measuring ... but if the final 'product' I have kit bashed, 'looks' good to me, then I'm satisfied (though I probably wouldn't enter any of my stuff in contests where 'fine scale modelers do the judging'  .

I have seen some incredibly beautiful kit bashing by modelers on this forum. To me, it is a real delight to see the results of such craftsmanship in kit bashing, scenery and model building done by many on this forum. I'm an 'old guy' and like to be by myself when operating my trains ('cept when the grand kids are over!!) ... so it really doesn't make me jealous to see  others who are obviously very much better modelers than I am. I admire their work and their skills, and do the best I can on my own modeling attempts.

maybe some day, I'll get as good as they are, but I doubt it, and that's okay with me!

The main thing is, as Mr. Bach Man says, I'm 'having fun'.

lanny nicolet

[ap0317ah]

Lanny
      Having fun is HUGE part a this hobby and i think i don't need to tell you that.  i did look at your work on your 2-8-0 spec icrr looks great i did love to see the finished product. i would also like to say icrr steam is not what i model. That would be the B&O. Great work

Tom
     

[Stephen Warrington]

Thanks guys,

It was worth asking and thanks Ray for the answer. Maybe the local schoolhouse could use some boilers when the IC dieselizes its not like I dont have 6 Green diamond GP18s in storage and 4 SW9s. I am sure theGM&O would like its 0-6-0 back since the darned drawbar won't stay connected it is a first run P2K model nice runner with very short trains because of that crappy drawbar. I am beginning to rethank on ordering a P2K IC 2-10-2 with sound because of the drawbar problem.

Stephen

[SteamGene]

Stephen, the Proto 2000 USRA 0-6-0 and the 2-10-2 use two different kinds of drawbars.  The Santa Fe is much more conventional. 
Gene

[Stephen Warrington]

Thanks Gene,

  I couldn't tell in any of the photos of the 2-10-2. I just know that one onthe 0-6-0 is a royal pain in tha caboose.

Stephen

[joegideon]

Hi Guys,

I just got my 2nd 2-8-0 from Bachamnn and when I sat it in front of my two lemon Hallmark 2-8-0s the loco dementions matched perfect now here is the question. Would a new Bachmann chassis and motor fit on a Hallmark Boiler?



here's a shot with them side by side. The RI will soon be senttoTexas for conversion into a IC 2-8-0 or a close copy of one.

Stephen

First- I must say I'm happy to- all of a sudden- see all the interest in the I.C.!  I have been lobbying Bachmann for years to, at the very least, do a 2-8-0 in Central road name... I think the response here demonstrates that Bachmann wouldn't lose money by catering to I.C. fans...  After all, they 'stole' the Consol. from the I.C.!

I, like many, have a Hallmark.  I bought it from Peachcreek Shops for $170.00; it had a Faulhaber geared head motor and some other improvements... sounded good to me.  Except...  It ran quite well!  Then, one day I started a train with the 2-8-0 up front and it started a little hop action.  It got worse, then stopped cold.  Up[on examination, I saw thatthe problem was that the spokes on the main driver set had simply crumbled.  This is a problem with a lot of older brass models with zamac driver centers.  Many Akane articulateds had this problem.  Nothing to do but replace the drivers.

I attempted to do a hybrid and- with some work- simple stuff like the front stairways need be moved from the frame to the superstructure-- or is it the other way??  Anyway- the previous owner had filled the boiler with shot and epoxy, so the Bachmann cylindrical unit could not fit; I see no reason why it couldn't work, though.  The Bachmann patterns were struck from an old Hallmarl I.C. 2-8-0..The only changes were the tender and the air pump.  Otherwise,you can literally see that even the detail parts, injector, bell, whistle, EVERYTHING! was a copy of the HMK!  I am using the pilot-deck-mtd. pumps on a Bachmann.  I made new running boards from Safe-T-tread brass and it'll look fine!  Howard Zane had offered to sell me three rat Hallmarks for $200. and I passed it up, dang it!  The tenders alone...

Has anyone ever seen the "I.C." 2-10-2 that Sunset did twenty or so yrs. ago?  While it ispretty much a USRA, it has pretty fair renditions of domes.  I have one and, unfortunately, it's far too rare and expensive a piece to scavenge. But it has a lotta problems: Southern gear, USRA cab, USRA tender, etc.  But here's another hybrid that might no be toooo farout there...  I have a Samhongsa MoPac 2-10-2 and the chassis will fit under a Hallmark 4-8-2 super.   I know a few people that have several of the 4-8-2s... Usually, one is d.o.a.  I haven't quite figured out what that would make!  But it's certainly in keeping with the Paducah folks' methodology! 

Now.  When the @#$%@##@ is Bachmann gonna do an undecorated 2-10-2 with the Baker- NOT Walschaert as the advertising says- valve gear from the S.A.L..  No-brainer!  It'd take 'em an hour to set it up.  I guess they want to sell the extra engines.  No- I'm NOT trying to make an I.C. out of a "Light"-

So , let's keep the heat on these guys!  The I.C. and the GM&O guys are getting a lotta play recently- Now we need to get Kato or IM to do GM&O F3s in 'N'.  And an RS1 and 3 in the old paint style.

Incidentally, I have had some success fabricating domes from sheet styrene.  I cut the ends from .030 sheet and the "wrapper" from .010.  I Bond the three parts, then fill 'em with "FLEX" paste from Woodland, then- when hard- shape them with files.  It works well and is fairly easy.

Thanks!

Jim Snyder
Monterey

[ap0317ah]

Jim
I agree competly even thought i am not a ICRR modeler but i would have if there where any aforidable IC locos around when i sold off all my santa fe locos.  Sence there were not i built my 1920's B&O layout. Now that i have invested a large amount of money in B&O steam i will more than likely not start an ICRR layout. i have no regets about modeling the B&O in the 1920's for i had relitives that worked for the B&O and the PRR during the 1920's and 1930's. Anyway i would have liked to have modeled a road name with a little less infunece by the USRA. Not to say i don't like the great eastern railroad congalmerates. (i do remember i Model the B&O i also like mopac or anything that has to do with trains for that part  ). i wish that other have the chance to model the ICRR.
contiune this tread JIM.

Good luck
Tom