Berkshire Comparison

[Michigan Railfan]

The GP 20 & 30 series were the only Proto 2000 locos that ever had issues. And when you bought yours, everyone else knew that they had issues, so they did not buy them. And the Proto 1000 subway set wasn't Life-Like's/Walther's/orP1K's fault, all it takes is gentle handling and care. I still contend that from the sounds of it you are not using as much care as what is required for finely detailed HO scale representations (models). If you are having trouble handling locomotives I suggest you try purchasing less detailed model, which will save you money and you won't lose or break your detail parts. Another alternative may be moving to a larger scale where locomotives are less prone to damage from rough handling, and the detail parts are harder to lose or break.

Well, the pantograph falling off wasnt my fault.  It derailed on a switch, and almost took a tumble to the floor, but in the process, the pantograph fell off. And, several of the pantographs were out of their holes when I bought the set.  I had no clue that the GP20's and 30's were really the only ones that had problems.  Any other of my engines aren't extremely detailed, the only other engines I have are from Athearn (non Genesis) and Bachmann Blue Box, as engines haven't been a real importance to me so far. I mainly focus on frieght cars now. And I don't have the money to move up to a larger scale, and then I wouldn't be able to run them on my friend's layout.
All in all, I do take good care of my trains. The only ones I really don't take care of are Life Like standard cars and engines, since you can get a GP-whatever  for about 10 bucks.

[Doneldon]

unc-

B-E-A-Utiful!!  Thanks.  I'm using one to build a Polar Express for my grandson who is in love with the story, the train and the music.

          --D

[Joe323]

I've been reading this thread  awhile.  I cannot directly address the berks however, I can say from the products that  I do have that most of my locomotives both steam and diesel that run on a regular basis are Bachmann.  They seem to strike the right balance between not being too toy like for me in terms of operation or quality and on the other hand being too fragile (detail wise) that they fall apart from normal handling.

BTW I had the same problem with the pantographs falling off the subway set, so I glued them on.

[ABC]

Well, the pantograph falling off wasnt my fault.  It derailed on a switch, and almost took a tumble to the floor, but in the process, the pantograph fell off. And, several of the pantographs were out of their holes when I bought the set.  I had no clue that the GP20's and 30's were really the only ones that had problems.  Any other of my engines aren't extremely detailed, the only other engines I have are from Athearn (non Genesis) and Bachmann Blue Box, as engines haven't been a real importance to me so far. I mainly focus on frieght cars now. And I don't have the money to move up to a larger scale, and then I wouldn't be able to run them on my friend's layout.
All in all, I do take good care of my trains. The only ones I really don't take care of are Life Like standard cars and engines, since you can get a GP-whatever  for about 10 bucks.

So it's Proto 1000's fault the loco derailed is what your saying. For the record I did not say it was your fault, I just said it didn't seem to be the manufacturer's fault. And for the GP-30, you just happened to be unlucky to choose that loco I guess. Had you been a few years wiser, you would have been able to make a more informed decision and as a result have a better perspective on Proto 2000 products, which as a whole is really pretty solid aside from their two large blunders, one of which, unfortunately, you purchased.
I also really like Proto 1000's rolling stock for their fair amount of detail, nothing that'll get lost or broken and I just bought a three pack of 100-ton hoppers for $25 total. Not too shabby for three hoppers. They are great for the money considering that they have Proto-max metal knuckle couplers (the equivalent of Kadee #5s) and nice free-rolling metal wheel-sets.
Here they are, the Proto 100 hoppers I purchased:

[Michigan Railfan]

So it's Proto 1000's fault the loco derailed is what your saying. For the record I did not say it was your fault, I just said it didn't seem to be. the manufacturer's fault. And for the GP-30, you just happened to be unlucky to choose that loco I guess. Had you been a few years wiser, you would have been able to make a more informed decision and as a result have a better perspective on Proto 2000 products, which as a whole is really pretty solid aside from their two large blunders, one of which, unfortunately, you purchased.
I also really like Proto 1000's rolling stock for their fair amount of detail, nothing that'll get lost or broken and I just bought three pack of 100-ton hoppers for $25. total. Not too shabby for three hoppers. They are great for the money considering that they have Proto-max metal knuckle couplers (the equivalent of Kadee #5s) and nice free-rolling metal wheel-sets.

I wasn't saying it was their fault, I know it was mine, I guess. I wasn't blaming them.
I will admit that their rolling stock does seem pretty nice, from what I've seen online and at hobby stores.  I guess I was just unlucky with my GP30.  I know it sounded like I'm not going to buy any Proto engine or rolling stock, but just probably not until they come out with something I need or want, and at a decent price.

[Joe323]

I agree about the Life Like cars I have some and they really are not worth doing maintence on.  I also have a few of those cheap Life Like Locos Same comment.

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

I gotta vote on Bachmanns 2-8-4. I have 3 of them, 2 in C&O and 1 in B&O and they out pull my LLP2K BErkshire


^Bachmann

^Proto 2000
to me the Bachmann one looks better, while the Proto has a better low speed it lacks pulling power and very delicate detail parts. I had the Bachmann one pulling 24 hopper cars with out any slipping on a slight incline. the LLP2K one had hard time pulling 5 spectrum heavyweights.

[Doneldon]

ABC-

So it's Proto 1000's fault the loco derailed is what your saying.

Blink neither said explicitly nor implied that Proto 1000 had any responsibility for the derailment.  All he said is that the pantograph fell off when the train almost made a swan dive to the floor.  And he isn't attacking Proto/Life Like, or you either, for that matter.  He's just telling us about his experience.  I, for one, and I know I'm not alone in this, enjoy hearing about everyone else's experiences.  I learn a lot from it and I enjoy the opportunity to kick ideas around.  But I don't think anyone is getting personal or trying to put a bad rap on some product or manufacturer that doesn't deserve it. 

I've said this before and I'll say it again: Let's all just be friends and stick to the topic at hand so we can all enjoy this thing.

          --D

[jbsmith]

Has anyone taken the plunge and got one of the new Berkshires from MTH?  or even seen one in person?
how do the MTH compare to the two already mentioned? the descriptions suggest lots of detail.
The pricetag reflects that too.

Features;
Die-Cast Boiler and Tender Body
Die-Cast Metal Chassis
Authentic Paint Scheme & Cab Numbers
RP-25 Metal Wheels Mounted On Metal Axles
Directionally Controlled Constant Voltage Headlight
Operating MARS Light
Prototypical Rule 17 Lighting
Detailed Truck Sides
Detailed Cab Interior
Opening Cab Roof Hatch
Powerful 5-Pole Precision Flywheel Equipped Motor
(2) Scale Kadee Compatible Couplers
Metal Handrails and Decorative Bell
Decorative Metal Whistle
Sprung Drive Wheels
Synchronized Puffing ProtoSmoker System
Locomotive Speed Control In Scale MPH Increments
Detailed Tender Undercarriage
Interchangeable Traction Tire-Equipped Drive Wheels
On-Board DCC Receiver
Operates On Code 70, 83, & 100 Rail Curves
Wireless Drawbar
Engineer and Fireman Figures
Operating Marker Lights
Lighted Number Boards
Operating Tender Back-up Light


the thing has TRACTION tires?  ok so i have an aversion to traction tires.
Prototypical Rule 17 lighting?  I have no idea what that is or means but by golly this thing has it!

[jonathan]

After seeing some MTH engines up close, they are pretty.  But I don't know if they are double or triple price pretty.  An engine can only run so well (diminishing returns compared to tracklaying quality).  Perhaps it has something to do with them being made in the USA (DC area?)

Again, not trying to saying anything disparaging (the Code), they are really nice, just beyond my needs or means.

Regards,

Jonathan

[Doneldon]

Those MTH Berks are outstanding but the price is truly daunting.  As I said earlier, buy three Bachmann Berks and three Sound Bugs.  Install the bugs, sell two locos on ebay and keep the third for free!

          --D

[SteamGene]

The Proto Kanawha's can barely pull their own tender.  Go Bachmann. (OTOH, there are errors for C&O)
Gene

[Pacific Northern]

The Proto Kanawha's can barely pull their own tender.  Go Bachmann. (OTOH, there are errors for C&O)
Gene

True for their first run production locomotives.  The subsequent runs include an additional driver with traction tires. Pull much better. However, I would not buy a locomotive with traction tires.

Also the Proto Street prices are two to three times that of the Bachmann offering. The Bachmann has slightly less detail but is not as fragile as the Walthers Proto Heritage model.

[ABC]

The Proto 2000 Berks are usually selling for $100 including shipping on ebay as seen in this link.http://cgi.ebay.com/HO-SCALE-PROTO-2000-C-O-2-8-4-STEAM-LOCO-1755-/250630973520?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a5ac52850
The Bachmann 2-8-4's are going for roughly $85 to $90 including shipping as seen here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/200471952485?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item2ead0f3c65
So, there really is not much of a price difference. I'd pay the extra $10 for a loco that has finer details. The only thing the Bachmann loco has that the P2K one doesn't is DCC however, the P2K version with DCC and sound is going for about $160 including shipping.

[Pacific Northern]

The Proto 2000 Berks are usually selling for $100 including shipping on ebay as seen in this link.http://cgi.ebay.com/HO-SCALE-PROTO-2000-C-O-2-8-4-STEAM-LOCO-1755-/250630973520?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item3a5ac52850
The Bachmann 2-8-4's are going for roughly $85 to $90 including shipping as seen here:
http://cgi.ebay.com/BACHMANN-HO-DCC-EQUIPPED-2-8-4-TRAIN-UNLETTERED-50949-/200471952485?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item2ead0f3c65
So, there really is not much of a price difference. I'd pay the extra $10 for a loco that has finer details. The only thing the Bachmann loco has that the P2K one doesn't is DCC however, the P2K version with DCC and sound is going for about $160 including shipping.

ABC
Why am I not surprised you came up with an e-bay listing of a used item?

The market is not controlled by e-bay.