how much is too much(Lincoln Funeral car)?

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

I've been after a Lincoln Funeral Car by AHM/Rivarossi .

I saw one at a train show for $90! I've seen em on ebay go for as high as $200.

I finally won one this week for $62(that includes S&H)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270572234544&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT

Did i spend too much? It says pocher but i'm sure only AHM/Rivarossi did those.

[jonathan]

It was not too much if you really wanted it.

Look at it this way:

There are certain things we all want, including myself, that we are willing to pay too much for.  The reasons are different for all of us.  It's not a question of value or worth.  There are certain things you want in order to complete your collection.  No one can answer why we want to collect things.  It's just stuff after all.  Still, it fills a void, or provides some kind of satisfaction. 

My small collection needs certain things, or it won't be 'finished'.

If you are in a business frame of mind, then you are looking to buy low and sell high.  We collectors tend not to look at it this way.  I don't intend to set up a booth anytime soon.

Sorry to get all philisophical. 

My two cents (or nonsense) are now deposited.  Enjoy your new treasure!

Regards,

Jonathan

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

I was just wanting to make sure I didn't spend too much considering its listed as FAIR condition. Looking at the pics I should beable to fix her up as new. I also recently just got some more of the con-cor old time coaches to paint up for my dogs Funeral train that I only have finished the loco for. The train will consist of a Baggage car, 2 Open air cars(1 will be used as a "coffin car" and will be switched out on "bad weather" days with a coffin coach which will have a combine interior with a coffin at one end) and 2 - 3 Coaches(If i can find my other bachmann coach body which should fit the rivarossi/con-cor frames)

all the concor cars come with interiors.

[full maxx]

yeah I would say 200 would be a little steep but not if you really WANT it

[Colorado_Mac]

I often say one of two things to my kids when they are contemplating a purchase. 

1.  If someone offered you a Ferrari for $15,000, that would be a great deal, but you still couldn't afford it!

2.  I COULD pay $10 for a gallon of milk, but I WONT.

As others have said, there is really no such thing as "too much" if you really want it and can afford it.

Congrats on your score!

[jward]

value is a sunjective thing. that said, i can't see myself paying that much for ANYthing by AHM......while i am not familiar with this particular item, most of the stuff they put out was pretty bad even by the standards of the 1970s. locomotives with little detail that ran like slot cars, freight cars that needed at least as much in parts sunk into them as the car itself listed for, just to make a decent runner out of them. this is the stuff that gave HO train sets a bad name.

[J3a-614]

Like Jeff, I wouldn't normally go in for anything from AHM in that era simply because so much better material is out there now, but this car is unusual, and your only other alternative would be to scratchbuild it.

In my opinion it's a bit extravagant, but not excessively so given its condition (which, from the photo, is far better than most other things I've seen that are that old), provided you're not going into bankruptcy or going hungry or something (which is getting a bit common these days).

Real extravagance is brass engines, especially some that are in the 4-digit range.

By any chance, have you checked out the "Early-Time Kits" thread?  There are some links in there to craftsman models that are a little tougher than average, but some are for prototypes from the 19th century, and might be something you could use.

Let us know if you're satisfied with its condition when you get it.

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

value is a sunjective thing. that said, i can't see myself paying that much for ANYthing by AHM......while i am not familiar with this particular item, most of the stuff they put out was pretty bad even by the standards of the 1970s. locomotives with little detail that ran like slot cars, freight cars that needed at least as much in parts sunk into them as the car itself listed for, just to make a decent runner out of them. this is the stuff that gave HO train sets a bad name.

I own a bunch of AHM/Rivarossi things, and thier OT freight cars are very decent(if you think about it, I think Bachmanns toolings are copies of the AHM/Rivarossi toolings.

I thought about scratch building the car, but i couldn't think of how to mount all 4 trucks without two not turning.

I own several AHM and Rivarossi locos, happy with em all(tho some have been converted onto other chassis mostly due to the gears and all being abused and torn to shreds)

I hope to have this car by the end of the week.

[J3a-614]

Having four trucks swivel is not a big deal.  You just use something called a span bolster.  It's a seperate beam-like structure that connects with the center of each truck at the ends, and is attached to the car in its center, with swivel capabilities at all three locations.  You'll see this on your Lincoln car when you get it, or you can see it on an Athearn 4-truck flat.

The diagram in this article for an American rail-mounted 14.5" Navy rifle (which would be used for either coastal defense or as a seige gun) from what looks like the World War I era shows span bolsters connecting two six-wheel trucks at each end.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c7/14_inch_50_caliber_railway_gun_Mk_I_right_elevation_diagram.jpeg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Span_bolster

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Heavy_duty_flat.jpg

Hope this helps, and hope the car is what you hope for, too (although I have to admit I would change out wheels and couplers--Kadees and metal wheels have spoiled me!)

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

the couplers are definatly being changed out, tho to EZ mates not kadee's

[Johnson Bar Jeff]

I've been after a Lincoln Funeral Car by AHM/Rivarossi .

I saw one at a train show for $90! I've seen em on ebay go for as high as $200.

I finally won one this week for $62(that includes S&H)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270572234544&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT

Did i spend too much? It says pocher but i'm sure only AHM/Rivarossi did those.

I remember seeing that listing! I usually follow these funeral car listings just to see what the final price turns out to be. I have two of them myself, one purchased brand new in the 1970s and held onto ever since, the other bought on eBay--from a seller who didn't really know what he had so that it wasn't listed under AHM/Rivarossi. One lives in my display case, the other gets run behind a couple of Virginia & Truckee passenger cars.

Are you aware that, based on the picture, the car is missing its smoke jacks? There should be one at each end of the car, on opposite sides.

I'm not really sure about this, but I think Pocher may have manufactured the old-time rolling stock for Rivarossi, which was marketed in the U.S. by AHM.

I share your view of AHM/Rivarossi old-time rolling stock. Personally I think the AHM freight cars are better looking than Bachmann's version--though not as nice as MDC/Roundhouse's old-timers. The Bachmann old-time passenger cars have always struck me as some sort of knock-off of the cars AHM/Rivarossi made beginning in the late 1970s. Con-Cor's cars are also identical.

The late (red box) versions of the Rivarossi old-timer 4-4-0s are outstanding engines. They look great and run beautifully. I have several. I even bought one that was "cosmetically challenged" but was assured to be a good runner in order to swap an IHC "Jupiter" superstructure onto the Rivarossi running gear. I figured that would work, and it did.

[ebtnut]

Just as a point of prototype fidelity, the original Lincoln car almost certainly had link-and-pin couplers, like most everything else from that Civil War era.  Janney didn't patent his knuckle coupler design until 1873.  If I were going to have the model solely as a display piece, I might put on the link-and-pins.  If you're going to run it on your RR, then go ahead and use the EZ Mates. 

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

got the car today, all in all its in pretty decent shape. Gotta figure out how to mount couplers to it without body mounting them(though i may have to probably use elmers glue as the train car wont be under much haul)

[BaltoOhioRRfan]

also it says Pocher made in italy....so i assume its a rivarossi car.

[J3a-614]

I haven't even seen one of these cars in probably 40 years, much less ever had one apart, so I can't really claim any familiarity with them, but from your comments about having to glue couplers in (and not body mounting them) suggests the couplers are Rivarossi's unusual horn-hook jobs.

Kadee (the coupler people) have an extensive set of charts for coupler conversions, some of which go back a long way.  Your particular car isn't in the list, but I am going to guess the couplers are mounted in the ends of the span bolsters, like the talgo-type trucks used on regular passenger cars by this firm.  Kadee offers parts for these talgo trucks, and I suspect this might be something you can use.  I also suspect that your couplers might work with Kadee's mounting gear.

Links are enclosed for your perusal; let us know if this looks like something that can be used.  With the internet, it's almost a sure bet someone else will either have the information you need, or your material will help someone else with a similar challenge.

http://www.kadee.com/conv/holist.pdf

http://www.kadee.com/conv/ho.htm

http://www.kadee.com/conv/hocc2.htm

I'm guessing the ends of the span bolsters look something like this, but don't take my word for it; check the other conversion instructions, particularly for the other passenger cars, there is a very good chance I'm wrong about this.  I haven't even seen one of these things in decades, and never had the chance to take one apart.

http://www.kadee.com/conv/pdf/ahm31.pdf

Tell us how this turns out.