train set up

[full maxx]

when adding turnouts to a dcc command set do the turnouts have to be dcc command too or can they operate with the switch they came with

[ABC]

DCC systems like the Bachmann Dynamis for instance can only operate DCC turnouts with decoders, they cannot operate any non-DCC turnouts. Standard DC switches will not work with DCC systems, so you must have a standard power pack with Alternating Current for accessory use to power the switches for the turnouts, because DCC systems do not provide AC for accessories. You can use manual switches with either standard DC or DCC control, but you cannot use standard DC switches with DCC, they would function just as regular turnouts, provided you had a separate power pack to supply the power.

[jward]

it is a common fallacy that you can only use ac for non dcc switch motors. the standard twin coil switch motor will also operate just as well on 12 volts dc. as proof, consider how many model railroaders use capacitor discharge units to provide more kick to throw those motors. capacitors will only charge when dc is applied, with ac they pass any current right through.

given this information, i don't see any reason that you could not use the dcc power to throw non decoder switch motors. they'd only draw power for a second when you pushed the button on the controller. i haven't done this personally, though.... perhaps our resident electronics expert can further clarify this.

[ABC]

given this information, i don't see any reason that you could not use the dcc power to throw non decoder switch motors. they'd only draw power for a second when you pushed the button on the controller. i haven't done this personally, though.... perhaps our resident electronics expert can further clarify this.

I didn't say you could only use AC, I just suggest he use AC, but DC also works. The problem in using the DCC power en lies in the fact that the Bachmann E-Z command, what full max will be using, only has wires with an adapter to the E-Z track when purchased with a set that includes E-Z track, but if purchased separately has leads for regular track also. So, if he wants to wire his accessories to the DCC power he must use those leads and also solder the wires to the track because he cannot use the leads with an E-Z track adapter. Also the E-Z command only provides enough amps to run 3 or 4 basic DCC engines or 2 sound DCC engines. So say he is running 2 sound equipped DCC engines or 4 basic DCC locos and then decides to throw some switches, then guess what happens you run out amps to power the turnouts and locos. And even if he is only running 2 DCC locos, throwing the switch will still cause a drop in speed, significant if pulling a good size consist up a grade that could bring the train to a complete halt and not able to get going again without backing up down the grade first.

[Jim Banner]

Jeffery, it would be my pleasure.

Regular, two coil, non-DCC turnouts will throw with either dc or ac or DCC track power.  This includes Bachmann non-DCC turnouts.  No problem there.

To tap off power to operate the turnouts, simple install an extra terminal/retailer piece.  These can not only put power into the track but take it out as well.  They even come with a length of wire for your convenience.  Hook that wire to the input connections on the switch that comes with your turnout.  These are the two terminals that would normally connect to your power pack.

ABC does raise a valid point about the amount of power available from an E-Z Command.  When you add together the power of one or two trains running plus a turnout when you push the button, it might be enough to make your E-Z Command think there is a short circuit and turn itself off.  This is very unlikely to happen if you are using a booster with your E-Z Command but all too likely to happen if not.

My advice would be to buy a "wall wart" power supply, rated 12 to 18 volts ac or dc at 1/4 amp (250 milliamps) or more.  You might even have one around from an old printer, scanner or whatever.  Or your local thrift store may have a pile of them for a couple of dollar each.  Use this instead of your E-Z Command to power your turnouts and you will not have to worry about them ever overloading your E-Z Command.

When the day comes that you want to add some lighted buildings, street lights, or animation, consider using another wall wart supply.  That will give you steady lighting that doesn't dim when you throw a switch and you will not be robbing any power from your turnouts.

Jim

[full maxx]

I totally get it ...the motor that works the switch is isolated from the track, I thought the track gave the switch its power and the button just completed the circuit to move it either way but the track just keep feeding which ever way the switch is going, it has nothing to do with the motor of the switch...so your saying any 12v power supply will work the switch whether the train transformer is plugged in the wall or not...even a car battery for instance

[Jim Banner]

RIGHT ON!!

If you are seriously considering a car battery, may I strongly recommend including a fuse (5 amps maximum) in series with one of the connections.  The switches that come with turnouts sometimes stick and the power stays on, melting the turnout and shorting it out internally.  A virtually unlimited power source like a car battery can deliver enough current to burn up a shorted switch and its wiring too.  A fuse will not necessarily keep the turnout from melting and shorting but will make sure that the shorted turnout does not go up in smoke and your house along with it.

If you were going to use a car battery, then I assume your would have a battery charger to charge it once in a while.  If that were the case, you could eliminate the battery and use the output of the battery charger instead (but I would sill use the fuse!)

Jim

[full maxx]

no no I'm not gonna use a car battery it was just a "for instance" just to say that any 12v source will power the switch , when you said coil I was totally hip as I am a heating and air tech and 24v coils are used for everything involved in turning on the equipment as far as control goes

[jward]

yes that would be a similar application. the switch motors are actually twin solenoids that are momentarily energized. which solenoid you energize determines which way the switch throws. the 3 wires that run from the controller to the motor are for the left and right coils, and a common return.

the convention is to use the black wire as the common, which can be daisy chained to other switch motor commons and cut down on the wiring. you don't have to run a black wire from each motor to the control box. the green wire sets the switch in the "normal" position, usually straight ahead, and the red wire throws it to the "reverse" position, usually for the turn.

[full maxx]

oh yeah I totally get it the only difference is in hvac is the switch stays energized until its time to let go like the contactor or fan/draft mtr relays reversing valve defrost cycle...