Scales

[mudhen]

OK now,
I have heard so many scales of model railroading.
I myself am using G Scale engines and rolling stock in 1/29 for standard gauge and engines, equipment in Narrow Gauge 1.20.3 (Fn3).
In one of my searches on the internet today , someone has come up with Gn3,???
Is this the beginning of another scale.
Sometimes I think people just make up scales to suit themselves because they mix and match there rolling stock and don't know the difference in scales or care too.
Scales I know in G scale are , 1:24 , 1:29 , both in standard and narrow gauge and 1:32 standard gauge.
Then Fn3 1:20.3. in narrow gauge.
I have no idea what scale LGB is, somewhere around 1:26 or there abouts I am guessing.
Anyone else care to comment on this Gn3 scale. Also feel free to add other G scale gauges I didn't mention.

[Skarloey Railway]

LGB is, nominally, 1:22.5, with 45mm gauge track representing metre gauge prototypes.

[Loco Bill Canelos]

In some countries Gn3 refers to the 1:22.5 scale on 45MM track, similar to LGB and The Bachmann Standard Line and Big Haulers line of 1:22.5 products.

There are many offshoots such as Gn15 and 7/8th all running on 45mm gauge track.

[Tony Walsham]

Bill.
I think you will find Gn15 is 1:22.5 scale running on H0 track to represent 15" gauge estate railways.

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Thanks Tony, There are so many oddities I can't keep up with it all anymore!!

[Tony Walsham]

That is the beauty of the hobby.
Model Railroading opens up the ability to express so much creativity.
I love the oddities.  Usually adapted from the equipment originally sold in other scales.
Long live the kitbasher.

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Kitbashing is my favorite sport!!

[scottychaos]

Scales I know in G scale are , 1:24 , 1:29 , both in standard and narrow gauge and 1:32 standard gauge.

Incorrect..
technically there is only one "G scale", and it is 1/22.5 scale, which represents meter gauge on 45mm track.
1/29 and 1/24 are not "G scale"..

the problem is, the terms "G scale" and "G gauge" are used as generic terms to mean "anything that runs on 45mm track"..
The better term for "anything that runs on 45mm track" is "Large Scale", not G scale..

So, if you believe there is only the one G scale, then "Gn3" makes perfect sense..it would be 3-foot gauge in 1/22.5 scale.
but! another problem, because I suspect the people who actually use the term "Gn3" are probably referring to meter gauge,
not literal 3-foot gauge..if that is the case, they should technically call it Gn39.3701 scale..but no one is going to do that!
but yeah, overall the various scale designations in "Large Scale" are a bit of a mess..always have been.

I have never had any complaints, corrections or even debate over the terms used on this chart:



link to full size: http://www.mylargescale.com/1stclass/garyArmitstead/Large-scale-scales2.gif

So I think its pretty well accepted, overall, that G-scale should properly only refer to 1/22.5 scale.
which is mostly produced by LGB.
Scot

[scottychaos]

And there is nothing wrong with creating new scales..it still happens occasionally.
1/29 scale has only existed for 25 years..(Aristocraft Alco FA, 1988)

I created a new scale, it's called 29n2 scale:



The Alco PA is 1/29 scale.
the Forney is 29n2 scale.
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/Scottychaos/29n2/29n2-page1.html

I created 29n2 scale because I wanted to model Maine 2-footers alongside 1/29 scale Standard Gauge trains..
as far as I know, I am still the only person who models in 29n2 scale..
and even if i'm the only one ever, that's ok with me.  
Scot

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Don't know what the heck I would call my scale , I use some 1:22.5 items and some 1:20.3 items along with 1:24 and 1:32nd scale people and a few short 1:22.5 people and 1:24 scale people on my steam powered "standard gauge" indoor Missouri Western Railway layout.  Buildings, a little of every scale many home made to "whatever"  scale which actually looks great with the rest of the hodgepodge .  If things look OK to me from 10 feet away, I am happy .  I never obsess  8)about scale in Large scale because so little is really available.  Just try and find a 1:20.3 truck or automobile, not a lot out there, or 1:29th for that matter.  There are lots of 1:32 scale autos and trucks which I use with my mixed    1:29th/1:32nd scale stuff on my outdoor layout. 

Bottom line if things look ok to you then don't worry about it, just have fun!  In over 60 plus years of model railroading I have never had someone look at my models and say "Gee Bill, you are using a 1957 Ford and it should be a 1956 Ford in this scene"  or Gee, Bill you are using 1:22.5 engine with a 1:20.3 engine to represent standard gauge"   Most of the time it is the opposite, they feel things look great and I am asked  where I found this or that item (out of scale actually) so that they can get the item as well.

If you obsess over everything and it is fun for you great, if you fudge the scale stuff and are having fun that is great as well. Even Scot fudges using 1:29th scale but is having fun with it even though it is not 100% correct.

Correct is what is correct for you!!

"Just have fun"

Bill

[charon]

Bill,
For automobiles, I use the Hubley 1/20 scale metal car kits.  They are from the 1915's thru the 1930's and are fun to build and paint.  Right now there are 28 listed on Ebay priced from $29 up.
Happy Bachmanning!
Chuck

[GG1onFordsDTandI]

One of the reasons I don't concern myself with scale much, is I personally find the whole shebang full of buzz words, and very confusing. There ought to be a better way to classify. I'd prefer it if the scale ratio numbers, as in 1:24, were used everywhere first and foremost (1:24 was also the original G scale, not the more correct 1:22.5). If the scale of the track gauge is off, a figure denoting this could be added after.
Terms like O, S, large, standard, #1, and G whether talking of scale or gauge, should only be used as generic terms if you ask me. And the technical aspect, should be referred to by ratio numbers, which would work for any measuring system. A good system I say would list, 1- ratio of scale. 2- track gauge and code used. 3- the (+)/(-)ratio of track to the proto. Most people would never care about the last figures, but it would let the rivet counters keep counting.
Much of this confusion is instigated by manufacturers using buzz terms. Computer software companies are a great example of confusion caused by buzz words. When I run into buzz terms, meant to enforce brands vs attempting to achieve a terminology "norm", I buck back hard. A demand by you, the consumer, for simplified, standardized, terminology is the only way to cease the nonsense, no matter what the product.  

[Kevin Strong]

(1:24 was also the original G scale, not the more correct 1:22.5).

There may have been 1:24 trains before "G scale," but they weren't called "G scale." That originally was a marketing term coined by LGB for their line of 1:22.5 trains. G stood for Garten (Garden) or Gross (Large). (Early US importers called it "K scale", for King.) 1:24 as we know it today came about because the math was easier for US manufacturers (1/2" = 1') and there were already extensive products for dollhouses, etc. available as accessories. As has been said above, "G scale" has since become a generic term for all manner of trains that run on 45mm track, regardless of particular scale. If you go to a hobby shop and ask for "G scale," they're going to show you products with scales ranging from 1:32 to 1:20.3. While I agree that "Large Scale" is a far better term to use as an umbrella term, the die is unfortunately already cast.

To their credit, the manufacturers today are generally pretty good about stating the scale of their products on their boxes. Some are better than others, but anything's better than the nothing we had years ago.

Later,

K

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Kevin is very correct about the impact of the first LGB trains.  I spent about 12 of my 33 year military career in Germany and bought one of the very first sets they came out with, at the then whopping price of about $66.  Back when they first came out the G stood strictly for "Gross" or "Large" and there was no other major brand of what we now call G Scale or Large Scale. They stated from the beginning they were suitable for outdoor use.  LGB held the bragging rights for the biggest baddest largest trains around. At the time, Garden Railways magazine did not exist nor did Bachmann Large scale or other manufacturers, all that came later.  G for "Garten"  or Garden evolved as time went on and the popularity of LGB exploded and outdoor railroads became popular.   Although we had fun with our LGB, I was personally put off by the European prototypes. Being military we never had a chance to do a garden railway so the LGB set ran around the tree at christmas and we acquired more track and flat cars which my kids used to deliver presents.  It was always chaos around our place at christmas.  I was always  an HO scale fan, but when Bachmann came out with the 4-6-0 my loyalty switched to Large Scale. There was no confusion about scale at the time and most of us called it G Scale.  The generic G scale stuck and the LGB 45mm track became the standard.

In spite of a still relatively small number of followers, I am amazed at what is actually available to us.

Chuck, the Hubley vehicles are extremely nice,  do you have any pictures you can post of how you use them in your modeling scenes??  

Have fun, Bill

[GG1onFordsDTandI]

Lehmann Gross Bahn, I will concede the outdoor marketing, and first official use of G-scale as part of it. But most of the previous garden railroads were 1:24, #1 gauge(44.45mm, close enough for me), and I remember reading about a couple garden railroads in old 1940s and 50s model RR magazines I had. The ones I saw as a kid were not LGB, way too old, and the man Gramps knew, did refer to them as garden trains constantly(an E or F carbody, and a 2-4-2(?)). Coincidence? Maybe. I hadn't even realized the .05mm gauge difference till just recently.