track power

[SteveWard3928]

Red Solid wire connected to right terminal on power pack
Blue and red striped connected to left terminal  (AristoCraft T-5400)

I have the blue-red striped wire to outer rail (red to inner rail).

Train was in a dead spot of track.  I was getting ready to run other wires when the add on wire (paired with the striped wire) accidentally touch the outer rail.  The train took right off.
My question:  Do I still have to run an additional wire that will be paired with the solid red wire?

OR

Can the train run smoothly on 3 wires or do I need 4?   
   
Situation has been resolved.  Thanks to all for helping me!!

[Chuck N]

Check your rail joiners. My guess is that you have two that aren't conducting.  The first problem one should be right behind the engine where it stopped.  Before you fix that one, put the engine on a section of good track and run it in the opposite direction.  It will stop after passing over the second bad connector.  If you fix the first one before finding the second one, you will never find it.  The current goes in both directions around the loop.

How long is your loop of track.  That will help us know if you might need added jumpers.

You really need only two wires.  One to each rail.  I don't know why you have a third wire.

Chuck

If you don't have a multi-meter, go to Radio Shack or a well stocked hardware store and get one.  You should be able to get a good one for less than $25.  It should measure volts, resistance (ohms) and power (amps).  In order to determine if you need added jumpers, measure the voltage in three places: 1, at the posts of the power supply, 2, the track voltage where the wires from the power supply join the track, and 3, the track voltage at the furthest point away from the track power clips.  If you have 20 volts at the transformer, you should have 20v at the track.  If the voltage at the furthest point is much less than 20 v, add an additional power feed.  

You can also check the resistance of the rail joiners with the meter.  Measure the resistance on each joiner, by putting a probe in each rail coming to the joiner.  If the joiner is good, there should be no resistance.  If there is a problem, it will show up as a resistance.

Another test for needing a jumper is does the engine noticeably slow down as it gets further from the track power connections and then speed up as it comes back the other side.  This visual test works best on level track.

[SteveWard3928]

ok Chuck my best guess is I am only running about 130 feet of track. This is my first outside layout so I wanted something easy to handle.  I have not seen a notable slowing of the train.  Just a dead spot.  And I do have 24 new rail joiners coming out of Texas and those should be here Friday. I just heard of guys running power to different parts of the track to help with consistency of power. So I thought I would try it also.  I was ready to hook up wire #3 when it touched the rail and the train took off.  I was wondering if wire #4 (which would be on the other rail from wire #3) was actually necessary. 

[Chuck N]

Wire #4 wouldn't hurt, but you should remove #3 and check your rail joiners. Then add 3 and 4 back. 

What kind of track are you using, brass, aluminum, stainless steel, nickle silver?

Chuck

[Loco Bill Canelos]

Definitely check your joiners using the method Chuck pointed out
"Check your rail joiners. My guess is that you have two that aren't conducting.  The first problem one should be right behind the engine where it stopped.  Before you fix that one, put the engine on a section of good track and run it in the opposite direction.  It will stop after passing over the second bad connector.  If you fix the first one before finding the second one, you will never find it.  The current goes in both directions around the loop."

Do not add wires til you have done the above

[Joe Satnik]

Dear All,

To troubleshoot rail joiners (connectors) on a loop,

break your loop by pulling apart adjacent track pieces. 

Start by pulling apart the joint to the left of the (single) power pack connector,

and run the loco to the right til all bad track connections are discovered and fixed, bringing the loco around the loop to the break on the left.

Stop, re-connect the left break, then pull apart the joint to the right of the single power pack connector, 

and run the loco to the left, running around to the break on the right. 

If you are satisfied that all rail joiners are conducting well, then re-connect the right break.  Your train should now be able to go around the entire loop without stumbling or stopping. 

Add as many track power tie-in points (Lionel calls them "Lock-Ons") as desired, being careful to match tie-in polarities.  (One color bus wire feeds the inside rail everywhere, the other color wire feeds the outside rail everywhere.) 

Hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik 
   

[SteveWard3928]

Situation has been resolved.  Thanks to all for helping me!!   

[Chuck N]

Steve:

Was it rail joiners, or something else?

Chuck

[Joe Satnik]

Dear Steve,

Glad I could help. 

Usually I try to give an old connector a gentle squeeze with a pliers to tighten it up,

then work it in and out with the next track section's rail to try to scrape the joint clean. 

Solvents on a Q-tip would help remove old grease.   

The only reasons I would replace a connector would be if it were impossible to clean the inside of the connector,

or if the connector had been squeezed or bent so many times that it would not hold its shape anymore (to grip the next track section's rail).

I think LGB has some kind of joint compound to help maintain rail to rail connections. 5101 or 51010.  Expensive though.

Greg Elmassian on MLS suggests wheel bearing grease as a cheap alternative.  Graphite or moly. 

Its job is to keep moisture and dirt out of the joint, and not wash away in the rain.  Keeps metal to metal clean and free of corrosion (oxidation).

Hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik

[Chuck N]

Steve:

I just saw your email.  Glad the new rail joiners helped.

The LGB rail joiners have a tab that fits down in the first tie.  To remove it you need to get a good pair of pliers and pull on the end of the rail opposite the joiner. Slide it back past the first tie and the rail joiners will come free.

Chuck

PS If you post the email that you sent to me, it might help some others.

PPS  Another way to remove an LGB rail joiner is the use a screwdriver and a hammer.  It also requires a third hand or some device to hold the track down.  Take the screwdriver and place it on top of the rail joiner where it connects with the rail and hit it with the hammer.  This will slide the rail down the track and the joiner will come loose.

PPS If your LGB rail joiners are still in one piece, you can pinch them, as suggested by Joe, and that should improve the electrical contact.  Especially if you clean the rail and the inside of the joiner with a small wire brush.  I use a graphite paste (LGB) in the joiner to help keep it clean and slow any oxidation.  In order to pinch the open end closer together for a better contact I use a pair of vise grip pliers.  With them I can set the jaws for a pinch that isn't too much.  The bottom line is that LGB joiners should be good if they are cleaned and set for a tighter contact.  You shouldn't have to replace them.